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My question is how do you run a Democratic primary candidate against a supposedly Democratic president without doing so much damage that a Reublican is elected as a result? The problem is, this Democratic President isn’t really a true blue democrat. He’s more of a pastel-red Republican.
How do you send a message that a more populist president is necessary for the United States to bring about the hopey-changey promises the American people want and need? The only way, that I can see, so that the establishment does not misconstrue what the people want, is to run a left-leaning primary candidate against the president in 2012. In the past, the Joe Liebermans start their echo machine of the need to pull more to the right after a clear message such as Massachusetts is sent. The election of a left-leaning primary candidate in 2012 would be a definate indicator of what the people want. But again, you run the risk of doing too much damage to the current Administration that you may end up with a John McCain.
There are whispers of Hillary Clinton being nominated for a Supreme Court Justice position. My intuition tells me that this is a way for the Obama Administration to get her out of the way completely. But Hillary has already indicated she does not want another year in her current position as SoS. Not that HC is to the left of Obama, she just has more backbone and has fought hard for the American people in the past. I imagine we would have gotten a better HCR bill out of the Senate had she remained there.
Folks, our only pro-active approach to fixing the current state of affairs is to quit our bitchin’ and do something about it. Since the American people are stuck in a two party system, the only thing we can do is elect better politicians and presidents. Another 7 years of this Administration will be sheer-torture. (no pun intended) We need a strategy, and a candidate. Any suggestions?
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It’s a tall order. Policies are important, but to really do it, you need someone with real charisma. I’m not sure that leader is out there right now, or if they are, they haven’t been “discovered” yet…
3 more years of this crap and anyone off the street will be more popular than Obama. So I really wouldn’t worry about doing damage.
I’d focus mostly on just finding someone who will legitimately represent the publics interests.
On a side note, an older candidate might be better. They have less incentive to line thier own pockets.
I can name at least one, although I’m not sure he would in 2012: Dennis Kucinich. Of course, the problem is that he wouldn’t be allowed in debates and he’d face retaliatory primary challenges from the right of the DOP (my new nickname for the pseudo-left wing of the GOP, aka the Democratic Party). I really think we’re going to have to go outside the party on this one, build up the Greens or some other progressive party and make sure that, unlike in 2000, the leftist indy really does have a spoiler effect. We need a Perot-level split among Democrats, with the leftist indy candidate forcing the larger, more established party to move to the left if it wants to win elections ever again. If the conservatives can do it with Perot, then we on the left can — and should — do it with Nader or some other strong third party candidate.
As for doing further damage to the Democrats and ending up with a McCain presidency (or worse), it’s already happened. Obama IS the McCain presidency. And because of it, Democrats’ pope of false hope will lose to whatever batspit insane GOPer put up against him.
Pres Howard Dean
Elizabeth Warren
Howard Dean
I read yesterday on Open Left that Obama’s support in his first year has dropped 37%. And then today I read the OFA has lost a vast majority of the support it had in 08.
Obama is very vulnerable and may not even make through the primary as it is if he does have a challenger in 12.
Howard Dean
Who’s been right on everything?
Who could mobilize the Internet for millions in just a few days?
HOWARD DEAN 2012
Let’s get this going NOW.
Yep. Howard Dean & Elizabeth Warren, exactly. Or Dennis Kucinich- if only people could be sufficiently awakened.
Now is not a minute too soon.
if only people could be sufficiently awakened.
You said it…that’s the problem with our Democracy…the majority is fast asleep at the wheel…that’s a REALLY deep sleep. But it doesn’t hurt to do what we do here!
I don’t know, Ocean. It seems like we’ve been stuck in this nightmare (like having your wet hand around a live wire) for such a long time and the last few years has been a succession of very rude awakenings. I am more optimistic. I think people have a better idea of what they want (& need) and that was what got Obama elected. It’s turned out to be a cruel hoax (so far), but I don’t think people just went back to sleep. I think, MAYbe, (I HOPE) people will listen a little more carefully next time. The trick will be making sure the right candidates get heard. Imho, that means to find new ways outside the usual channels of media/ etc. The MSM & the pundits could get a whole lotta discredited between now & then.
Thank you. I like your optimism and I think blogs like this one will help to wake up people. We need a lot more soldiers, so let’s keep it up, otherwise we are defeated. Cheers.
I love Howard Dean and used to prefer the Democrats over the Republicans in all major elections. But the “Democrats?” What Democrats? The ones that reneged on every promise they made since 2006? They’re no different than the Republicans right now. So practically speaking, I don’t think the excellent choices of Dean and Warren would make it through the Super delegate flawed process (correct me if I’m wrong on Super Delegates), but it would be great if either of them or someone with their charisma ran independently if defeated in the primary. Unlikely scenario, but will someone do some math and see if there’s a chance for another Democrat to beat even a weakened Obama in a primary? Cheers.
Michelle Obama.
The implied circumstances would be rather stunning. God forbid that they should come to pass. But with the Cheney-ites still operational… it may be unthinkable but not entirely unlikely.
Think November 8,1923… Or could it be, April 19, 2010?
It will be interesting to see just what kind of opposition the inside the party types will mount against Obama in 2012. Probably not much. I like Kucinich, but he will never even get nominated in this country let alone elected. Grayson appears to have the ability to put up a contest, especially with his opposition to the banksters and the rape of what remains of our financial system. But my guess is he is too much of a team player to actually run in earnest. That leaves the prospect of Obama running pretty much unopposed leading to more of the same buttressing of the plutocracy through protection payouts (subsidies, unregulated financial gambling and unfunded mandates to health insurers) to get a little help for the middle class. The only individual in a position to defeat Obama in 2012 is a Republican, who will do the same without as much of the help. No, I don’t endorse Obama, I say bring the Dems down so we can get going on stronger opposition to the plutocracy. As long as the Dems are in power we will be working at cross purposes.
Very succinct. If you has said Rahm Emmanuel I would have concurred.
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And now, back to “As The World Burns”. Brought to you by Citizens United and “Nine Days That Changed The World” coming Spring 2010.
Nine Days shares this extraordinary message…a message that inspired a revolution and changed the world
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Suppose there is a militant, xenophobic, ultra-rightist secret organization — let’s call them “Patriot Identity” who’s Motto is “Supremacy Through Strength”. Let’s also suppose there is a secret splinter faction in the organization called the “Cheney Wing”. Suppose that faction’s aegis is “Armed Rebellion”. Suppose PI/CW/AR launches an operation code-named Stheno.
Can you guess the mission? Will the turmoil last until the 2012 election? Will it lead to a double dip depression?
You Betcha!
Will the Dems ultimately uproot PI/CW/AR and the Bush torture legacy and win the election? Yes, it is already baked in the cake. It is just a matter of the frosting.
I choose chocolate.
So that’s how Obama wins in 2012. Especially if it happens to be Michelle.
no national (D) of high profile would risk their career to run against a sitting President.
no national (D) of high profile even has the principles to want to.
so, rather than yearning for an Impossible Pony, you can weigh some various valid tactical options: vote 3rd Party, write-in, blank ballot for president, or abstain from the charade of false choices, as so many Americans do for whatever reasons.
scolding from (D) partisans is mere self-interested GOTV advocacy, increasingly discredited as the (D)’s reveal once again how they govern when in charge of everything.
simply as a matter of conscience, it would be risky to want to support a candidate who is ratcheting up tensions towards an attack against Iran, as you would have a share of the resulting mass death and suffering on your conscience.
Elizabeth Warren.
Why?
a) Truly an outsider.
b) Truly a voice for the middle class.
c) Easily identified-with by many women, and generally non-threatening to men. Has such a common person/common sense way of speaking. Conveys real moral and practical outrage without also conveying a sense of off-putting anger.
d) Would resurrect all that female fervor for a woman President that got behind Hillary.
Now we need to figure out who to run as VP. One (crazy or not-so-crazy?) suggestion: Biden. He would help cover her lack of foreign policy and legislative credentials. He might make the “real change” of her candidacy more comfortable for voters.
I’m all for Dean/Warren in ’12.
Problem is, the DNC and DLCC won’t support them one iota.
They won’t even make the ticket.
So, the REAL problem is NOT wishing for candidates, but finding a way to FORCE the DNC and DLCC to EMBRACE more progressive candidates . . . I don’t see THAT happening soon.
Ergo?
I got nuttin other than to repeat, like a broken record.
Massive civil disobedience, non violent, HUGE and ongoing marches, boycotts and work stoppages for force system change . . . from that the progressive influence on the system might grow.
But as long as the DNC and DLCC run the Dem Party, we’re screwed.
The corporate oligarchy owns and operates BOTH parties, top to bottom, lock, stock, and barrel.
Somebody who accepts public financing for their campaign, and who tells us who their Chief of Staff will be beforehand.
there’s someone already doing it. and working to appeal to independents, including tea party independents.
what do you think about warren mosler?
Mosler 2012 – The Return of Public Purpose
Keep it simple.
Front Man: Alan Grayson for “them’s fightin’ words!”
Sidekick: D. Kucinich, co-president, for integrity and consistency
TreasSec: Elizabeth Warren
AG: Elliot Spitzer
SecDef: Joseph Stiglitz. Hey, if the Pentagon ain’t our de facto industrial policy, what is? Outsider w/ Nobel ‘Peace’ Prize, to boot.
HEW: Howahd
SupremeCourt pic: Vaugh Walker
AgSec: Michael Pollin
State:James Galbraith. Sharin’ and carin’.
More suggestions? Not too early to mash up a Dream Team, and put the whole lineup out front as the Loyal Full-on Dissenters…
I think a lot of people would get behind that lineup. At this point, I hate to hear people naysaying primary or third party opponents. We can always decide not to go that route later. But in the meantime, we need to create buzz out there for alternative candidates so that TPTB understand that we are in no mood for party line lesser of evils crap any more. Why not dream up dream teams?
I think Howard Dean would be a good pres. He’s got executive experience and political experience. He helped a lot of the legislators get into office as DNC so he should have some pull with them, and he wouldn’t be afraid to say what he feels about corporate giveaways. Elizabeth Warren is also good. She’s got cred on both the right and the left and is smart enough to get good advice in any areas like foreign policy that she might not have as much experience in.
You might even get me to vote for Dems again with that line-up.
Saviors Of The Republic. Hyperbole, but maybe not so much.
well a primary is less likely to result in a republican President than a general election challenge, since with a primary there is a chance that a real dem will win it. However, since as you admit Obummer is a pastel republican, why is the possiblity electing an honest one a bad fate?
I hope he gets a primary challenge, and if he wins the primary or is not challenged, I hope he gets a general election challenge from the greens or independent progressives. We really have nothing to lose at this point, since he is already a republican president. If he loses at least we will have eliminated a republidem from the party rosters, which will help the party in the long run.
His goldman sachs comments and continued support for corporatism aka “bipartisanship” prove him to be too silly to win. Howard Dean, Kucinich, or Michael Moore, would be fine by me.
President Dean! Has a nice ring to it.
Vice President Sherrod Brown. He’s the real deal. Or Al Franken for the name recognition.
Cabinet: Elizabeth Warren, Alan Grayson, Paul Krugman, Elliot Spitzer, Riss Feingold, Brooksly Born. Raul Grijalva should be running the Democratic Party. He plays hardball.
And I say pack the Court!
I like Elizabeth Warren for President. I Like Warren Mosler too. Both are outsiders. I might prefer Mosler if I’d seen him more than I’ve seen him so far. I like Mosler’s understanding of economics tremendously well. But, I like the impression of iron integrity I get from Warren. I don’t think she’s afraid of anything, and she has a great talent for talking about ideas in ways that people can understand. She also answers question directly. I’ve never seen her dissemble. I wrote about Warren and Matt Taibbi’s piece about her here.
About Dean, I just think he’s too mainstream on economics and would not make the important changes we need. Nor would he support Medicare for All, which along disqualifies him as far as I’m concerned. I wouldn’t vote for another candidate who didn’t back either Medicare for All or a full-blown National Health Service.
I agree about Dean too mainstream on economics and health care reform.
You’re also correct about Warren’s iron integrity and seeming fearlessness, which makes her seem so reasonable and so stable.
I would love to see Dean on a ticket, however, I truly believe that video of him screaming (yes, I know it was edited to eliminate background noise from the crowd) would follow him around like a chain and lead anvil.
For those of us old enough to remember the debacle of ’72, when we managed to get our real choice, George McGovern, nominated only to see him crushed, it’s poignant to recall that government cannot rise above the level of the electorate. To elevate another idealist before educating the masses would be electoral suicide. I don’t know how to get there: our educational system is in decay, and big money now has a green light to buy every election with subterfuge. Will it take a real Depression to turn the tide, or would that invite a fascist demagogue? As Paul Krugman has said, hard times brought about the New Deal, but it also brought about the Third Reich.
A wise comment. But you also need to take account of the personal qualities of the candidate and their role in victory or defeat. McGovern wasn’t a good candidate. He evoked little excitement on the campaign trail and also played into the Nixonian narrative that he was “weak” by reversing himself on his running mate Tom Eagleton, and throwing him under the bus.
What I like about Warren is the apparent strength of her personality and ability to project simple, though also honest and correct explanations of difficult issues from the viewpoint of the interests of poor people, saving the middle class, ending the domination of the corporatists. She can really talk to people in common sense language.
Mosler is very good at that too, but I don’t think he has quite the fire of Warren in his critique of the system. The fire is something we need to reach people and mobilize opposition to the corporatists.