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I am especially interested in the opinions of FDLers who denounce those of us in swing states who want to consider voting for Obama. When Obama had a lead in Wisconsin, I was planning to vote for Jill Stein. Now that the polls have tightened, I’m very seriously considering voting for the President. For those who want me to vote for Stein, are YOU filing with the federal government? Are you PAYING your federal taxes? That’s what funds torture and so many of the policies we all find so un-American and anti-human.
“In 1982, Hunthausen withheld half of his income tax to protest the stockpiling of nuclear weapons and the Trident missile program which had a base nearby, in Puget Sound. In a speech, he said, “Trident is the Auschwitz of Puget Sound.”[6] This tax resistance prompted the Internal Revenue Service to garnish his wages. This angered members of the U.S. military and the Reagan administration, as well as politically conservative Catholics.”
Seattle Arch-Bishop Raymond Hunthausen
To FDLers who denounce those of us in swing states who are considering voting for Obama, are you on the record urging others to file but NOT pay their federal taxes? If so, please provide a link. If not, please explain why you are NOT calling for the de-funding the uniparty’s policies at the same time you criticize me for considering a vote for Obama.
A prior MYFDL post was entitled, “Is it immoral to vote for Obama.” Responding to that, I wrote a post titled, Is it immoral not to donate $20/month to FDL…… I have lots of exceptions, starting with someone being able to afford $20/month. Then I moved on to folks such as Jane, Scarecrow, TarHeel Dem, and many others who had the raw courage to submit to arrest, to protest unAmerican and anti-human policies. My exceptions extend to deeply committed folks like Wendy Davis, wigwam, alan, and so many others who keep this place going with insightful and well written posts and comments.
I would argue that we have not yet reached the point where FDL and other lib/prog blogs should call for Americans to file, but not pay their FEDERAL income taxes. IMHO, it’s helpful to compare and contrast the ways we fulfill our responsibilities as citizens, the strategies and tactics of civil disobedience being one vital component. One size does not fit all. I’m a Badger. If Romney wins, he’ll increase voter suppression at the federal, state, and local levels. That will make it easier for the GOP to elect Scott Walker for a second term as Governor.
I also believe that the U.S.’ position today closely resembles Germany during the Weimar Republic . The forces stacked against us are daunting. I believe various forms of vigorous civil disobedience, which we desperately need, are less likely to work under a Romney administration.
17 Comments
By all means, vote for Obama in Wisconsin. I’m voting for Stein, but I live in NY. If I were you, I’d vote for the lesser of two evils. Like Chomsky says, it’s still less evil. That’s not insignificant.
You’re lucky: your vote counts. Choose wisely.
I’m not going to fault you at all. I was prepared to vote for Stein as I’m not in a swing state but the more I look at her, the more I realize that she is in no way prepared to actually BE the President. So this election I’m once again voting against other people, rather than for anybody.
Why does it matter if Stein is in your opinion not prepared to be President? Seriously. She obviously won’t be required to be and voting against your own interests and political philosophy out of fear doesn’t advance either. Voting is communication; if you don’t send a message that says what you actually want to say you’ve wasted the opportunity to communicate through your vote.
If people simply vote for what they believe in, the whole system designed to keep the electorate from meaningfully participating will no longer accomplish that.
Would second that.
Unless you’re in a swing state, I think a vote for Obama is a mistake. Both parties look at voting totals very closely and by precinct. When they see a lot of down ticket Dems winning and Stein getting a lot of votes, they’ll understand.
Fellow Badger,
It is nice to read about others’ thoughts and particular nuances through this national election cycle and for you to put yours out there for discussion and dissection. From someone who undoubtedly cannot claim to be a mystery to anyone, thanks for you posts, today and yesterday.
Fulfilling my civic responsibilities has been putting myself into the action of feeding the hungry, volunteering with the rural fire-fighters, putting my real name, address and phone number to local letters calling out unfairness and directly participating in the schools by standing up for kids and teachers and on and on. Local government is us.
Peace and resolve
nonquixote, much appreciated.
You’re entitled to your opinion. Aren’t I entitled to mine?
Please, point me to one shred of evidence that they “understood” anything from the Nader vote. From the Perot vote. From Liberals staying home in droves in 2010. I keep hearing all of these theories about “messages” and “lessons” but I have yet to see even one tiny mote of the most nuanced interpretation of any DC politician “understanding” anything or “getting” any sort of message, other than the message that siphoning off votes sometimes helps on party and sometimes the other. I wish what you are saying is true but it’s just not. I’d kinda like to be able to live to be 1,000 but it ain’t gonna happen.
You messed up. You forgot to capitalize, italicize, and bold the word “be.” Quit this bullying tactic pronto, please.
As you know, FDL and other liberal/prog blogs have to influence the Congressional districts with heavy D+ majorities. When Tammy Baldwin in the ultra safe Madison, WI seat won’t stand up to Obama on the public option,……. and many other issues, we have to hit back (that’s a metaphor) at mid terms. Bart Stupak won a huge victory for the anti-choice folks with a bi-partisan group of about 5 Reps in the Obamacare vote. If we had 15 tough-as-nails libs/progs in the House, we can do a lot. On close votes that’s a lot of people.
Another side is the civil disobedience. Regardless of who wins, we have to be prepared to demonstrate, donate, demonstrate, donate, you know the routine.
Another side is making smart alliances with wingnuts on those issues on which we agree. Legalizing pot is an obvious one. The numbers are on our side, but the corporate media continues to enforce the tribalism which impedes that progress.
As you know FDL’s national, but Dems have to take back state legislatures.
WRT global warming I think Mother Nature will give us a lot of help, unfortunately.
Walkin’ the walk
http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/vol18/issue32/xtra.wartax.html
And in 3+ years obama has demonstrated he is prepared to be president? The PTB can count on fear and a lack of resolve to maintain the feudal order. Complain all day long but ultimately do nothing to change it is as the shakespeare said:
The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars, but in ourselves, that we are underlings
Boo,
I understand the point of your post all to well and have had serious misgivings about how to vote this election season. Firstly, the faceade of democracy in the present US has entirely broken and that the reality is that there is truly little diiference between the candidates, outside rhetoric, on all the most pressing issues confronting us. There is zero said in the scripted debates about the fact that wihin less than a decade the arctic will be free of summer ice or that the US is experiencing proably the most severe drought in our history in the bread basket , where our food just happens to come from.
Obama , who campaigned on his credientials as a constitutional law professor and promised to protect that document from “the grave abuses under Bush” , has not only defended the worst of Bush but actually codified those abuses into permanent law . He claims the right to assassinate Americans in their own homes. Domestic spying has grown exponentially under his watch according to the ACLU .
It is entirely obvious that the lesser of two evilism has moved the country to the right and that a complete lack of accountability will only continue this trend especially in the face of such a betrayal as the one we have been dealt by this administration as regards basic civil liberites .
That said I think there can be a strong arument made for voting for Obama in a swing state, voting for a third pary candidate anywhere, including a swing stae and also boycotting the election entirely. Bullying is BS and I have seen and experienced a lot of it here at FDL these last few weeks. ( I’m not accusing you of that :)
As regards taxes , firstly let me say that I myself pay no taxes . My wife and I have a small business selling jewelry with eco designs in eco toursist areas around the northwest and elsewhere and we stop making money before we actually owe any. The tax code is set up for entrepreneurs and between write offs and having three children , the social sevurity (self employment tax )pays what we would have owed . This also allows us to take off half the year while generally spending a month or two abroad.
I believe that it IS in truth immoral to pay taxes if the taxes are used in a way that an individual believe to be evil . Principles are inconvenient sometimes. Espoucing principles which are not reflected in our lifestyles and actions means largely that we are not willing to inconvenience ourselves with the very principles we claim to believe in .
I would be very interested to know how it is possible for the avaerage worker collecting a pay check not to pay their taxes. Is this actually possible ?
Peace
Free,
You have to file. If you don’t file, the IRS will find you and prosecute you. Filing and not paying goes in another bucket. Eventually, they will want the revenue. Publicly announcing that we are filing but not paying, as Hunthausen did in Seattle, is a powerful form of civil disobedience.
Not sure what retirement plans you and your wife have.
I would invite you to check out the link in the post on the Weimar Republic. It’s the democratically elected German government that preceded Hitler’s takeover in 1933.
Vigorous civil disobedience has to start the day after the election. IMHO, it will center on Obama (win or lose) trying to cut (chain the CPI) Social Security in the “Grand Bargain” with a lame duck Congress. It’s at that point we’ll find out who in the heavy D+ Congressional districts should face a primary in 2014. It’s those districts that are also imho the center of any national 3rd party movement. If Romney wins, he and the GOP will engage in voter suppression in all three branches of government at federal, state, and local levels. GOP in local and state elections will have especially free reign to engage in voter suppression. That will cripple Democratic turnout. It will especially cripple Dem turnout in the heavy D+ districts (Madison, WI) that are the base for liberals/progressives. Those same districts are the best hope for a national 3rd party movement.
At the state and local levels, I see Dems as our only option against the GOP. Could be wrong, but except in a very few, I do not see Greens/3rd Party replacing them in state and local governments.
Great link. Thank you.
Oh, we have money in the bank , own two homes and have no debt. As I said the tax laws are constructed for the benefit of the business community, I’m not GE or Bank of America but I still profit by them .
Is there a way for the average worker not to have taxes taken out of their paycheck by their employers and pay at a later date ? If so this would be a viable strategy to advocte. If done by enough people the government would be hard pressed to respond and made to run the gauntlet, so to speak.
Then perhaps they would be forced to justify themselves in front of a national audience in prime time. Just a thought .
I’m not a tax lawyer and really don’t know much about “withholding.”
IMHO, tax laws are set up in favor of monopolies and oligopolies. Here in Wisconsin, they’ve made it really tough to figure out what the big employers pay in state taxes, because in most cases, it’s either zero or negative.