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(photo: The Lane Team, flickr)
The NYTimes is reporting that NY and California have agreed to sign on the 50 state deal and that is will immunize robo signing. If that is true, it’s over folks. The housing market is not going to recover any time soon and the court system will be permanently corrupted by forged and perjurious documents.
This settlement is an incredible breach of the social contract between the government and the governed.
On top of everything else, nobody seems to think it’s going to be helpful to the recovery of the housing market, help the economy, or do anything except bail out the banks, again. From the Times:
“I wouldn’t say it’s a panacea for the housing industry but it is good for the banks to get this behind them,” said Jason Goldberg, an analyst with Barclays.
Lucky banks.
Christopher J. Mayer, a housing expert at Columbia Business School, said the accord could give banks more certainty that they can clear their large backloads of seized homes, restoring the flow of those homes into the market.
Yeah, because it’s not like there are a shortage of homes for sale already?
About one in five Americans with mortgages are underwater, which means they owe more than their home is worth. Collectively, their negative equity is almost $700 billion. On average, these homeowners are underwater by $50,000 each.
A recent estimate from the settlement negotiations put the average aid for homeowners at $20,000.“I just don’t think it’s going to be a life-changing event for borrowers,” said Gus Altuzarra, whose company, the Vertical Capital Markets Group, buys loans from banks at a discount.
He’s right, homeowners will continue to be sacrificed like so many lambs.
On the other hand, the banks are evidently bribing the AG’s with money to use to pay for their investigations of—the banks. And useless consumer credit education, to perpetuate the myth that this is the fault of greedy or stupid homeowners who bought more house then they could afford; rather than the reality that they were fraud victims of predatory lenders.
Call your AG’s office, beg him or her not to sign. And remember this at re-election time. Read the Times article – there’s lots more in there.
165 Comments
Amen, Cynthia.
You and Yves are singing the same tune this morning. She puts the same thing you are talking about here atop her list at “The Top Twelve Reasons Why You Should Hate the Mortgage Settlement“:
I’m making the call to Jefferson City, but I don’t hold out much hope that it will do any good.
Obama, Holder, and the state AGs have not only broken the social contract, they have ground it to dust under their jackboots and pissed all over it.
Is there just ONE honest politician>
I am so pissed about Kamala Harris signing on to this I have to go take a waklk around the block to cool off.
the banks own us and that is as clear as the nose on your face. We can huff and puff but you think jamie gives a shit, or is losing a second of sleep over us huffing and puffing. Please he is probably having dinner tonight with eric slyderman and discussing when he will drop his fake lawsuit or if dimon is feeling generous he might throw a few low level bankers slyderman’s way, so he can look good.
You know what pisses me of is at some point today we will get jon’s poll results for repubs or repubs vs dems. Frankly just publishing those polls and discussing them as if any of it is real is a farce.
Well this settlement now puts the truth of how this country works on full display out in the open. Only reason they are doing that is because they no longer have any fear or give a shit what we think.
So do we call Schneiderman or do we shine a spotlight on whoever — likely to preserve the flow of banker cash into various politicians’ and parties’ coffers — ordered him to do what he did?
Rule of law, R.I.P.
Died from an overdose of pin-stripes and white-shoes, 2/9/2012.
Blank the Obama Administration, blank the state AG’s and blank the banks this is beyond wrong, this is evil.
Everyone who is underwater at this point on their mortgage should just walk away and leave the banks with inventory they cannot sell. If the social contract is truly dead then it is time for those at the bottom to do little or nothing to enable those at the top.
I tried calling her office but it’s closed right now.
I read it in my “nooz” paper this morning. It was a small article under the fold. Clearly the “editors” don’t want the 99%ers to be “upset” or clearly informed with how badly they are being screwed by the 1%.
Occupy AG’s & the Banks!
I have sent a scathing email to Kris Koster in Missouri. For all other Missourians who might be concerned you may visit here:
http://kriskoster.com/
Observations that the social contract has been completely broken are on point and correct. That contract is that the State will exact justice, so that individuals will forego their rights to individual vengeance. So, from a purely logical perspective, if that contract is now seen to be broken, what is the status of the morality of taking individual vengeance?
Yes but…
In my humble opinion the Occupy movement is the last real peaceful effort to bring about change. Now that it has been mostly crushed and all other avenues or redress have been co-opted or denied, now comes ugly.
Ugly will be riots, ugly will be violence. The Administration knows this will come because they have indefinite detention at Gitmo legal, they now can assassinate American citizens with impunity and if what I hear about the latest defense act is true, they can set up holding camps in the U.S.
All of this has been done because they know that people pushed too far with nothing left to lose will do extreme things. I don’t think they will be ready for level of ugly that is coming.
I don’t endorse the ugly that will come but BANK on it, it will come because the 1% have denied all of avenues of change.
It’s time for civil disobedience against the big 5 banks.
The social contract is dead.
I will make them pay.
Sounds like a plan!
It’s been this way since Columbus landed here. The more things change the more they stay the same. :(
“if that contract is now seen to be broken, what is the status of the morality of taking individual vengeance?”
Morality will be defined by those at the top I am sure but the individual vengeance you speak of will regrettable come soon.
Wrong! Rule of law still applies to the 99%. Try smoking a bit of weed, or speeding or ‘stealing’ a candy bar from the local mini-mart. There’s always another bed to be filled (and paid for with taxpayer dollars) in your nearby privatized prison. I think Warren Buffett was right: there IS class warfare . . . and his class can now hold up that index finger and do a victory dance. (Maybe it’s not the index finger they are displaying now?)
we now live in a country where you can rob the entire candy store and all you have to give back is the wrapper from the sweet you ate. Of course said robber must be a banker for everyone else their is a private jail financed by said banker.
I sent an email to Mike DeWine, AG for Ohio.
Dear Mr. DeWine,
With regard to you decision to sign on the the foreclosure settlement: F**K YOU!
Longer letter to follow.
Sincerely,
xxxx
You think the “99%” reads newspapers?
” if that contract is now seen to be broken, what is the status of the morality of taking individual vengeance?”
That’s the question RC.
Thanks Cynthia.
Really does make FISA look like the 1st Amendment.
Stay Classy
Homeboyz/girlz (un/deremployed, too): time to join OWSt. (the BERNANK$TER$) at The BARA¢KADE$!
Yea? Going to stick it to them where it hurts and move your $350 checking balance over to a credit union?
Looks like I owe ya a beverage. Whatchya drinkin?
I’m thankful that no bankster was injuried in this event;)
Yep everything is on schedule to fininshing off Main Streets on the plant.
OT but not make of this as you wish but the fish always stinks from the head.
The New York Times has a really bizarre story on the front page today.
First some bullet points:
* Juan Jose Rojas Cardona (“Pepe” and hereinafter I will refer to him as that) lives in Mexico and is part of the casino business (known as Mexico’s casino czar) with a very shady background and record. He is linked to violence and corruption in Mexico.
* Pepe is wanted in the USA for state charges in Iowa going back to the early 1990′s. After his Iowa conviction in the early 90′s, he was sentenced to 5 years but then he jumped bail on the Iowa conviction.
* Pepe surfaced a bit later, while a bail jumper from Iowa, in New Mexico and got in more trouble – this time with the Feds. He pleaded guilty in 1994 to Federal Drug charges. While on bail for THAT plea of guilty to Federal charges, he disappeared again. He later surfaced in Mexico (where he got into the casino business and where he was later accused of illegal campaign donations and orchestrating an assassination.)
* THE STRANGEST THING HAPPENED IN 1998 – 4 years after his plea of guilty to Federal charges. I have never seen this happen before — Federal Prosecutors, even though Pepe had jumped bail a second time (and thus avoiding prison) and was in Mexico beyond their reach, went to a Federal Judge and convinced the Judge to quash the indictment. Quash an indictment of a Federal felon who was on the run? I have never seen prosecutors do that. Why would they, after a plea of guilty to Federal charges, ask a Judge to dismiss the indictment? Ordinarily, the prosecutors would be doing the opposite. They would be begging the Justice Department to put pressure on the host country – here Mexico – to turn the fleeing felon over. Something is very odd about this.
* Out of the blue, beginning last fall, Pepe’s brothers, who live in Chicago, became big fundraisers for President Obama – achieving what is called the ‘bundler’ status. In total, the family gave to the President and the DNC about $200,000 in legal donations. What is odd about this is that no one had heard of the brothers before in political circles and then just suddenly showed up and they were raising money in big, big ways. [Note that since the NYT started sniffing around about Pepe's family's donations, the Obama campaign has said it will return the donations.]
I didn’t see AG Martha Coakley’s name above, thank goodness. Can one assume she’s still holding Mass out of this settlement?
“The Banks Won”
They always do. The thing to remember as you said is the elections. Also, remember that the governed DOES NOT CONSENT to this type of government.
I’m sure there will be more and more corrections to come from account holders that will surprise the Banking Elites. Their dirty tricks at taking over all the assets in this Country will soon be blocked.
“Jackboots”? Really?
The Nazi imagery is getting old, and it doesn’t work. All it does is rile people up *against* you. Like me.
Flagged. And frankly, if this is permitted I want my account terminated from FDL. I will not associate with any group who thinks this is permissible language.
Obama can engage in this repugnant breach of law only because he darn well know the GOP has NO chance whatsoever of occupying the White House in November.
If the Repugnicrats had a serious and reasonable contender to offer, (I know! I know! No one has spotted the Unicorn yet!) none of this shit would be taking place.
The banks will make it increasingly harder to use your own money. Just wait, the fees will sky rocket. They will hold your paycheck longer until the funds are released. The use of cash will be considered inappropriate. That little card in your wallet will be the only way you can eat, pay your bills, etc. Every time you use that little card it will take a bite out of your balance.
Nope. Only holdout is a GOPer who thinks the settlement is too hard on the banks.
Boxturtle (We must hope to change some minds. Not likely, the fix is in)
I’m part of the 99%, and I do. And yes, some of the 99% read them because there’s loads of letters to the editor responding to articles from previous days’ “nooz.” My guess is that most are in an older age demographic.
That said, I duly note how rightwing slanted most of the “articles” are, plus loads of war drums being beaten most days. Some of the political cartoons are spot on, though.
So, that is why all of those guns showed up in Mexico from our gov.
How do you know what that person’s bank balance is? You don’t. Your dismissive condescension is duly noted.
You might try it, yourself, one of these days… that is, IF you even know how.
Don’t let the door hit you …
You would think, being the cynic that I am, that I would have been prepared for this announcement. I’m not. I made the mistake of starting to have hope again. Silly me.
Can’t we all just look forward? Dear Leader from the first day of his administration said it was of no use to look backwards but rather to set our collective sights on a new dawn.
Yes indeed. That is where this is leading.
I belong to the “don’t get angy, get even” point of view. I don’t mean “get even” in a personal, vindictive way. But I do mean extracting political pain at least some of the people doing this to you – or, if that is out of reach, then extracting political pain on somebody politically realated to whoever is doing this to you.
I was going to write a diary about this, but never got around to it.
Basically, the argument is that progressives (and, in this case, in conjunction with populists who may vote Democratic) need to pick at least one elected Democrat incumbent, and go all out to end their political careers, making it perfectly clear that they are doing so to express their anger at this particular issue. If your punishing vote blocs actually have some guts (at least for it’s partisan members), then they will vote for the opposite party, even in a general election.
In this case, the same should hold for Republicans, where the pertinent voting blocs might be flexible populists + Tea Parties, e.g., and they single out at least one Republican, preferably who was personally involved in creating the mortgage mess.
It’s NOT essential to pick out an incumbent (or 10) who were personally involved, but of course it’s preferable.
If I ever write out a diary along these lines, I will relate it to a talk given by Bueno de Mesquita, the accomplished political game theorist, who talked about influencing top tier players by influencing 2nd and 3rd tier players in a foreign government.
If voters can’t or won’t organize themselves enough to deliberately and ruthlessly terminate the careers of people who screwed them, or people of the same party that screwed them, and probably would have screwed them personally, if they would have had the opportunity to do so, then these voters deserve what they get. The Veal Pen isn’t going to help you, neither will band-aid (i.e., mostly weak) organizations like PCCC, the so-called “bold progressives”.
That means that the little people have to create such organizational structures, and generate aggressive leaders.
PCCC already boast 850,000 members. If progressives had started a genuinely aggressive organization at the same time as PCCC, then it too, may have had 850,000 members.
FDL has done good work (thank-you) in supporting Occupy, raising a fifth of a million dollars. It’d be nice if FDL took the lead in developing a genuinely aggressive form of the PCCC, which makes no apologies for targeting some Democrats*, to teach those who survive their electoral challenges a lesson, but somehow I don’t think it will do so.
Who does that leave, FDL community? Come on, I know you guys can figure this out.
* I mean on a continual basis, as funds will allow. If there was an aggressive, progressive group, it would still be demanding an apology from Obama for his healthcare perfidy. And, to reiterate, I certainly don’t mean electoral punishment just during primaries, since you want to be “good Democrats” (though I readily admit that most lefties won’t have the stomach to vote for a Republican in a general; fine, then you can just boycott the Dem you’ve singled out for job termination. Not as effective, but it is what it is.) By limiting the total number of Democrats that you’re willing to throw under the bus (to, say, 5-10%), you can avoid a sea change of personnel in Congress to the Republican camp.
So do you have a cogent comment on the article itself?
Fuck. I am calling my AG again, but the die is cast. Settlement FAIL for homeowners.
I’d guess they’ve run out of other means for laundering drug-money, so they’re contibuting to political campaigns.
If unable to phone your AG there is always the “strongly worded” letter option.
Was there ever any doubt? The states took the money and ran, just like always. The laws are just for the 99%. Don’t worry, it will just get worse as they write more and more laws.
You are correct on what the banks will do to buffer any losses they might acquire from the foreclosure fraud deal. However, the people will reconstruct their own banking system and reroute the purchasing power away from the corporate types that will not accept cash in kind.
It’s coming. I am seeing it being spoken about in many places, both on the web and in the communities. People have had enough.
It will henceforth be simply impossible to determine clear title to any property in the United States.
He’s correct, I probably should have phrased it differently. Anger and betrayal sometimes make people speak their minds without routing it through the politeness filter.
My longer letter will be mailed this evening, sans profanity and any discussion of ancestery, personal habits, or probable destination after death.
Boxturtle (Admittedly, I plan to use the words betrayal and foolish a lot)
Quite a few folks have already done so, and several cities are looking at doing so. This will make more of them do so.
Tell the RNC or whatever right-wing sheltered workshop has “educated” you to send you better trolling points.
So RNC troll, what do you think of banks being given immunity for forgery?
Just find the “I will make them pay” hilarious. Want to remove your money from the bank fine, but don’t pretend like you’ll have the branch managers chasing you out the door begging for your business.
We all know who owns our homes. It ain’t us even if they are fully paid for.
At first glance, I’d say you’re on to something.
Get organized, decide who’s going down, and loudly announce your intentions.
Grover Norquist has been using that tactic for a long time and he’s completely trained the republicans to toe the line.
This is so criminal that it is repugnant!
I for one will never vote for this traitor to America again.
I don’t care if Newt the Nut gets the Republidemocrat nomination.
This is the final straw for me! I hope it is also for the millions of Americans who have just taken it up the ass one more BIG time!
When will the robbed rise up and demand restitution?
The banks threatened to withhold campaign contributions, is my guess.
Anybody bought a home lately?
How are the Title Insurance Cos. handling all these mysterious chain-of-title issues?
Are they selling policies as usual or are there vague addendums and attachments?
All they have to do is stop printing the cash. Don’t think it won’t happen.
I agree with you. I think we should work endlessly to out all those reps that voted in favor of NDAA and other bills that have taken so much from this country and its people. Not just one of the Traitors, Treasonous, Usurper, Tyrannist holders of office!
I think of FDL not only as an activist, blog, and Progressive Community. I think of it as a modern day think tank. Back a year or two ago Jane asked members what direction we should take as a group in the upcoming elections. Most people said not to place ourselves in the Presidential election realm and I agreed. Everyone was more concerned with Congressional, and state politics. If you notice most of this country in the last 4 years has had Teahadist Govenors placed in office. That has to change too. I say let’s not just focus on one, but all of them!
Also, you will notice that the right has been heavily focusing on voter fraud at every state level. I welcome that discussion because I think people can take it and run it all the way to fixing our election process for the better. Let’s start by removing paperless black box machines and instill transparent hand counting.
If you’re a city, they will be begging.
Oh? Is that what you think?
Funny, but when I closed my account, the branch manager DID come over to specifically ask why I was closing it, and then proceeded to offer me special deals to keep my money there.
I also got some phone calls asking what the MegaBank could do to get me to put my money back into their thieving bank.
But I do *confess* that no Branch Manager chased me down the street.
Seemed to me that the MegaBank was “unhappy” at least that I was pulling my money out their greedy mitts. I guess, though, that my experience doesn’t “count.”
Why? So I can spend the next 2 hours hearing from all sides about what a waste of carbon-based life I am or how I’m just a “Good German” who doesn’t give a crap about anyone but themselves?
I know how these conversations go – people call me every vile name in the book, insult my parentage, insult my intelligence, and suggest I perform anatomically-impossible acts. And the minute I respond in kind, I’m the one moderated for being uncouth and impolite. So why put myself through the heartburn for what essentially amounts to the rhetorical equivalent of a high-school beatdown?
I think the legit companies are doing the regular search and approvals. However, let me get back to you on those other ones. I’ve got many people I can call to get the facts.
If you buy a home, you are well advised to at least use a Credit Union for your mortgage. That will not guarantee 100% protection, but it’s better than using a MegaBank or any of these dubious mortgage companies.
Yep fast and furious ties into this. as does the shore bank who were tight with Obama was let fail and then popped back up with another name and an infusion of cash.
There’s a weak spot, in terms of having a valid vote, by your voting bloc, to decide who exactly drinks the hemlock.
However, I think authentication can reasonably be handled by charging 5 cents to a credit card (essentially handing off the voter authentication issue to the credit card company). Multiply replicating vote data by independent groups, that must reconcile, and, as a last resort, allowing individuals to submit a notarized vote, by mail, if they dispute what the independent groups are claiming as their true vote. (So, you’d allow for a reconciliation period of a week, after online polling closes.)
Yes, of course, people without a credit card would be discriminated against. If anybody has a better idea, I’m all ears.
I used to have a friend who worked for the CIA during the Vietnam War. One drunken evening, his girl friend spilled the beans about his interrogations. He then told us he’d take the Viet Cong up in helicopters, look everybody in the eye, and figure out “who was the weakest, and who was the strongest”. Before asking anybody any questions, he’d throw the “strongest” out of the helicopter.
Then he’d go to the “weakest”, and see if he wanted to talk.
My friend died very young, with a severe drinking problem. I think I know why….
Anyway, the point is you don’t need to completely eschew voting for every last Democrat, even though they’re collectively screwing you. You need to start throwing some of them out of the ‘electoral helicopter’, repeating as necessary (though with limitations appropriate for actual scenario; your dealing with a lot of demoralized and weak fellow progressives), until you get satisfaction.
It’s easy to make a cross; the hard part is nailing yourself to it. But don’t let me stop you.
Nonsense. “Individual vengeance” they can handle. This guy sounds like a black-bloc’er.
In fact, anyone still hanging on to “individual vengeance” is probably a domestic comprador.
And thus, my point is proven.
Here endeth the lesson. Good bye and good riddance!
If you knew your history, you’d understand why comparing to 1930s Germany has become so compelling. I suggest you go back to the Boggateria. Everyone there seems to find jackboots sufficiently fashionable for their taste. You will get hugs for being an Obamabot there. Out here where people actually add up the data, not so much. OH, and please don’t cancel your FDL account. Whatever would we do without you?
“”unhappy”"? What, you think corporations are people too?
I am really surprised that Koster signed on. Although, if the NYTimes has it right, the deal does not stop his prosecution of DOCX , nor prevent future procesecutions of document mills.
What it does is immunize the banks that are using tehse forged docs to do forclosures-assuming the Times has it right.
So, potential accountability for those who created the forergeris even up to the campany heads, but no accountability for those who used the foregreis to steal houses.
Well, while I have nothing against tongue lashing any and all Democrats and Republicans who are in the wrong, electoral discipline is another matter. I don’t think it’s practical to go against all Democratic incumbents, e.g., in a maximally aggressive way that I’m pointing to. In fact, ito maximal electoral aggressiveness, I’ve recommended 5-10%.
Now, jeffroby had a plan, call the Full Court Press, that targetted all Democratic incumbents, but only during primaries. I supported this plan (and still do, as a strategy). But this is a different matter. Practically speaking, the 5-10% will be faced with a non-vote, or, better yet, a vote for a 3rd party candidate, during a general election, if they survive their primary. (Again, most progressives can’t bear to vote for Republican, which is the surest way to guarantee a Democrat a loss in a general election.)
You might want to check out Recommended Short and Long Term Voting Strategies for the Dump Obama Movement and The Jesus Christ of Political Game Theory on the Stupidity of Lesser Evilist Voting and Tea Party about to cross the Rubicon, become more effective – Wimpy Progressives, watch out!
Don’t be an idiot. I posed a simple logical query. Answer it, or don’t. Your shtick is getting tiresome.
“trolling points” I like that. A welcome addition to the online lexicon. ;-)
This is now obvious in retrospect, but you’re still incensed. Now, if you were aboriginal, you’d have known this for a half-millennium.
Capitalism is a lie.
Thanks for the links. I will read and consider. My mind has been set to oust any member that voted for NDAA or at least put enough pressure on them to make them want to reverse.
I actually DO think that just like the banks created a shadow market for trading derivatives, that the people my well end up creating a parallel banking system. OTOH, the local community banks and credit unions are already there and not yet co-opted. They form an easy interim step.
Don’t project so much. So. You’re not a black-bloc’er; you’re only a black-bloc backer.
TWOOPH!
If the idea is to punish the strongest to impress the weaker with your resolve. You would probably want to start a recall petition against Harris and Schneiderman and Biden. Without them, the deal would not work.
I realize that incredibly intense pressure must have been brought to bear against them. The carbon in their bodies is probebly suitable for making engagement rings at this point, but the fact is –> they caved. They had all the power and strength they needed and they caved.
About a year ago I got a letter ‘out of the blue’ from BofA. They offered to refi my note for 15yrs. instead of 30, with a 2% drop in interest rate. No out-of-pocket and my monthly payments are lower.
It seemed like a good deal to me, but others here have said it was probably just done to cover their previous paper trail.
It’s the comprador, excuse me, the consumer reaction. It’s hard to watch the agony.
Cynthia,
I caught one of those elitiest agencies on twitter last night proposing that cities take those foreclosed homes under eminent domain and turn them into rental properties.
I replied that once again the tax payers will pay for the homes through local tax instead of just the Federal hooks that we are in for.
I wish more people would join me in asking the government that simple question:
HOW MANY more times do the tax payers have to pay for those mortgages? And, WHY NOT LEAVE families in the homes so they do not loose more value and wreck the communities? We’ve paid for it already!
Thing is, the chain of title has been broken on millions of properties, and as I understand it, the situation is possibly irreparable.
So how can the TI companies continue to do business?
It’s depressing to think that they would just continue to issue policies and collect premiums when they know the whole system that allows them to confirm their position has been scuttled and rendered useless?
In a way, considering that banks can make $billions selling CDS contracts based on debts that are not owned, and that they have good reason to believe they’ll never have to pay, why should title insurance companies not do the same?
People I’ve met who have come here from other parts of the world, have told me that it is only in America that a person might feel secure in the wealth that they might accumulate through hard work. In their home countries, the rule of law was so weak as to allow the rich and powerful to seize a person’s business or property with impunity and the help of corrupt government officials.
So it seems there is now no place left on earth that an honest but poor man can feel confident in protection under the rule of law.
In North Carolina, our AG has been unreachable for a long, long time. Nothing will happen here to keep NC from signing on (despite we have had a number of county recorders angry about rono-signing and MERS).
I wish it were not so.
My comment, however, is that the problem and the challenge seem incredibly larger than “politics” and two bought-and-paid-for parties (or three or four if you count ‘neo-libertarians’ and tea-baggers).
The problem is how to deal with the failure of capitalism. This has been pointed out by many, but until recently I had not heard any alternative voice speak clearly on the matter. The assumption is always that opposing capitalism is some kind of class warfare and therefore (automatically, magically) socialism or some other thing.
A couple days ago I stumbled on Henry George, a 19th century capitalist American who is all but forgotten. I am only reading his work now, so I am no expert; however, he seems to have soem very worthy ideas. His critique is a critique that goes to the heart of assumptions we in American have been making for a century about the meaning of labor and of what we currently call “wealth”. I encourage you all to consider him, particularly if you are sympathetic to the Occupy movement.
Mr. George was once very popular in America. I doubt Herr Professor Gingrich knows anything about him though.
Posing a logical query is not taking a position, it is only giving the reader a chance to express their thoughts. But it seems all you can do is leap to incorrect assumptions. Sad.
I’ve been thinking that sort of thing too.
They’re probably building some sort of immunity into refi deals.
Um, are you really comfortable mixing those metaphors? I think you’ve already shot yourself in the foot.
quote:
‘I realize that incredibly intense pressure must have been brought to bear against them.’
yeah, the Obama/Biden team, they need the banks to fund their new SuperPac.
I agree with you.
I also agree that municpalites should seize vacant foreclosed homes and make them homestead properties.
Family moves in and pays rent and is repsonsible for all upkeep and repairs and property taxes. A % of te rent gets credited toward a down payment. When the credit hits 20% (or higher) they family may apply for a traditional prime mortgage and if qualified may pruchase that house at market value.
Or they can continue to rent. This keeps property values from falling, keeps vacant houses from creating fire and collpase hazard and keeps property taxes flowing.
As for house that are not yet vacant–foreclosed upon but not yet eveicted homeowners should get the same deal and be able to stay in their homes.
COME ON State Legislatures, pass a homestead law!
You know the answers. Why ask the questions?
YES! You’re off the wrong track.
But a land tax? Isn’t that so last century prior?
Why bother with him? He won’t admit Capitalism is Theft.
Spitzer and Lanny Bruer had a little spat over failure to prosecute foreclosure fraud
http://on.wsj.com/x2ZpFq
Oh, they’re getting ready alright. I read they are preparing to launch thousands of drones in our skies. Welcome to the United States of Pakistan (or Yemen or Somalia or Afghanistan)
It’s on as far as they’re concerned!
We are headed for bigger crash than in 2008. With the Wall St casino selling and trading worthless derivatives and the banks getting away with murder, I can’t see how this whole deck of card will not tumble down. This time around, Oilybumbler won’t have the political capital to save his bankster friends. But I highly doubt the Wizard of O will try to reform the system; Oilbomber is a neoliberal ideologue, convinced that Social Darwinism and trickle on economics is the way to go.
It’s going to be bad, very bad.
It’s expressionism; a way to avoid the necessary conclusion. Or maybe to deflect the necessary conclusion, hmmm?
Leaping to incorrect assumptions? Yes, remarkable turn of phrase. Let’s call it higher-order logic.
I’m no savant and a kindergartener could have seen this coming, but this is what I commented somewhere two days ago:
“Gah. Obama is desperate to show he took on the banks. This deal will get done just like the Healthcare vote, preserving the Bush tax cuts and the debt deal. Obama will turn the screws. California and New York will be brought to heel. Any holdouts will get a ‘Kucinich Plane Ride’”
Never has so much effort been expended by a President for so little in return: Healthcare, debt deal, Bush tax cuts and now this despicable abrogation of our democracy to the Vampire Capitalists.
Maybe too much testosterone? That is a black-bloc affliction as well.
I don’t know what the fuck you are trying to say. Which seems to be your preferred style of communication, as any scan of your commenting history would immediately make clear. What I do know for sure is that I am not a “black-bloc’er” OR a “black-bloc backer.” So, you are full of shit for accusing me of being either of those. You are also getting to be very annoying.
When and if I get a reply from him I will post it. Thanks for your reporting and insight. I would pack up and leave if I could but nowhere to hide from these ______________ fill it in.
Hey, world empire was just a short-term fix. All the compradors can’t get that into their heads.
Oh, well, their offspring may not even have the time for history. No worries.
He was about a bit more than a land tax. You seem to be acquainted with Mr. George, so I assume you know that too.
Don’t play dumb, now.
Violence is not the answer.
No offense intended but have you taken the time to get to know him. I guess I am sick of the broad brush approach to peoples comments. This is supposed to be a place where people can express their thoughts not a whipping post.
When enough people get realize what is happening to them they will revolt. Call it what you will. My 2 cents,
I know it’s doubly hard for you, loosing faith that is.
But you can’t use the state’s means of punishment against it.
A noble sentiment, but keep in mind that, right now, there’s hardly anything going on to oust anybody, on the Democratic side of the fence. The Tea Parties have shown some real electoral aggressiveness, but they operate on the Republican side of the fence, so are irrelevant for our purposes.
What matters most is the resolve of a collective. You have to be guard against projecting your degree of resolve and aggressiveness onto the group of allies you need, to get anything accomplished, at all.
For those interested, an online library of George’s work is available.
http://schalkenbach.org/on-line-library/works-by-henry-george/
Well, I wasn’t really implying that. My main point is that you can effect a group by picking on one or two members of that group.
The most sophisticated “weeding out” or “process improvement” voting strategy that I can think of would involve bands. The idea is to make nobody, even those you think of as solidly progressive (e.g., Kucinich) think they’re immune from the wrath of your voting bloc. I’ve described this elsewhere, but don’t want to dig up links.
As I’ve also said, many times, I would prefer if progressives hired a competent game theorist to at least lay out some plausible strategic options for them.
Used Wikipedia to remind me.
For Free Trade.
For the Greenback.
Against Immigration.
For Secret Ballots.
In other words, a reformist.
Socialims or Barbarism!
Finally, after wading through 10 minutes of how to contact ‘my’ bank to get help with ‘my’ foreclosure, I got to leave a recorded message.
I spit.
Just a week ago I was yelling support for Kamela Harris.
Now I spit on the words.
What a failure as a human being
Again, I spit…
The reason I think he is relevant to Occupiers and to all of us is the original question George asked:
Why is it when an economy grows and people prosper, the gap between rich and poor increases? (Why doesn’t a rising tide lift all boats?)
George asked this question back in the days of Teddy Roosevelt and Mark Twain. Twain was a fan.
It’s really a rather obvious question and an appropriate one given where we are today, and that is why looking into this man’s ideas seemed to me both relevant and refreshing.
Her # is 1800-952-5225
Ludwing,Ludwig—premises,premises….
Yes, but the conclusion in AMerRica was inevitable.
Oh. I am sure he’s a fine guy to know. ‘Course that’s what they said of Bush II.
“Individual vengeance” is a symptom of the problem, comrade.
I’m practicing my dialectic.
No, back east, I already moved my very limited $$ to a credit union.
I will commit ‘civil disobedience’ to their property. They will get tired of the inconvenience of having to fix the the ‘civil disobedience.’
What are you doing, personally, to help the situation? Your posts are not doing anything but antagonizing others. why don’t you just go away? What pleasure do you get from your posts when you are just here to irritate others?
;)
Check out Gar Alperovitz.
You mean he was afraid to mention that he’d read The Moor.
BoxTurtle: Maybe amend your missive to read. “With regard to your decision to sign on the Foreclosure sell-out: YOU CAN GO MAKE SWEET LOVE TO YOURSELF.
I think you’re better off with Fock You.
Way to go Obama. If you think the people were pissed that you bailed out the banks and let them keep their bonuses, this ought to really get people to the point of pitchforks and torches
….FOR YOU!!!!!
Spite, cause you had to wait for the pain to get the picture.
It seems to me that the holders of foreclosed homes would like nothing better than to have all of the vacant/foreclosed homes seized by municipalities through eminent domain. This would force a “fair market” price to be paid, with tax dollars, to the very banks that helped create the crisis. Were this to happen, lobbyists would work their magic and the prices paid would be very favorable to the banks. Not only don’t they get punished for their fraud, but we would be paying them more to solve their problem of selling houses in the slow housing market.
I have often wondered what the banks want with a bunch of vacant and deteriorating homes. Why they would work so hard to foreclose as many as possible. Perhaps this was the long term plan all along. Man, what a sleazy mess.
Go back and crawl under the rock you came from. Why do you persist here? ?
Oh my goodness! Roast Kenyan!
You can get vengeance without being violent. You can also revolt without being violent. I am not speaking for him but I don’t take his question as a call for violence, IMHO I respect your opinion as I would anyone else’s. I think you can get your point across in other ways and don’t have to have to be dogmatic about it. Again my 2 cents.
Cynthia, how could we push to bring back the Glass-Steagal Act?
I really appreciate your posts and find it interesting when comments try to derail. Thank you for all your insights and taking the time to write.
Too entertaining?
Because some boats improve themselves through education, some boats hone the skills of their trade, and the overall the economy grows, despite the dumb-a boat sitting in his parent’s basement smoking up watching You Tube videos.
I can see the gap between rich boat and poor boat increasing in this economy.
Because we are trying to help the situation. You are here to antagonize people. You have no sense of community with the people here, so why do you persist?
Do you have anything positive to say?
About anything?
To anyone?
Toward any goal offered here?
Capitalism is dead. Long live Capitalism!
You can’t push on a string.
What is really happening is the U.S. is on the descent towards third world status. The populace is not taking it well, but we are probably past the the ability to halt the slide. The left is screaming about it, the right is screaming about it (and the two solutions are diametrically opposed) and the middle class, so far, is just gritting their teeth and changing the channel to “Jersey Shores”. Neither side will admit that it is too late, nor will they face the fact that it was short term thinking, brought about by 2-4 year elections cycles that led to our downfall. And the rise of China is going to make citizens apoplectic in the coming years. The Chinese think long-term and are certainly amused at the predictablility of the collapse.
It’s called scuttling, Redbeard.
It’s not a collapse, it’s a demolition.
Now don’t call me a Truther if you don’t mean it.
Violin, guitar viola , mandolin, auto harp, banjo, barbat, double bass, harp, koto, lute, lyre, pipa, rudra veena, saung, tambura, ukulele, zither, just to name a few
Sure, look up.
Boink!
Ah, clever. But comrade, you’re the one being played.
no honest pols,sorry
http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/americas/united-states/120207/washington-post-congress-earmarks-property
You can’t help by asking the wrong questions. Specially so late in the game.
I’m hoping y’all will dump the groupthink.
thank you for the post and it’s insights Sister
I keep thinking back to that April day in 09 when all round good guy Byron Dorgan (the guy who voted against repealing Glass-Steagall in ’99) voted WITH the Bankstas (and his Banksta lobbyist wife) against cramdowns
realizing in that moment that they really can and do get to anybody – forgive my belaboringthe obvious, but we need a new system
Dogmatic? Are you referring to my crypto-ideology? Might that dismissal be part of y’alls problem?
You can’t have “individual revolt”, comrade. And you know “individual vengeance” is just as stupid.
Besides, isn’t all “individual vengeance” violent, one way or another?
You need the tools of the collective, not the comprador.
@cbl February 9th, 2012 at 11:04 am
Short of a violent revolution, you’re not going to get a new system.
That leaves working with at least the framework of the current system.
Not a game theorist, a new game.
Hey, isn’t that the comprador’s position?
“You can’t help by asking the wrong questions. Specially so late in the game.”
Rather than superciliously respond with your apparently scathing condescension wrapped up in fake “concern,” why don’t YOU ask the “correct” quesions? If you are so “concerned” with the hopelessnes of FDL, then why aren’t you HELPING??
Methinks you’re full of it.
“I’m hoping y’all will dump the groupthink”
LIAR. You love things just the way they are so that you can be nastily condescending and attempt to impress everyone with vaunted uber-knowledge, which we pathetic aborignines (???) don’t have.
Either your part of the solution, or your part of the problem. Right now I’m seeing you as behind Door #2.
No. It appears this blogger wishes to impress all & sundry with his/her vast great knowledge and much better informed and “with it” s/he is than us “aborigines.”
I haven’t seen one damn thing yet that made much sense and/or was useful. Just a bunch of narcissistic twaddle.
DOn’t know how we get Glass Steagal back, But I agree with you it is desirable
I seem to recall that you were the one who made comments like this one. And I do recall another comment of yours about how much you disliked mealy-mouthedness (emphases mine):
He’s obviously not intending to argue in good faith, just to troll. Hence I invented a new word.
I am talking about how you react with people not your “ideaology”. It’s fine to hold an opinion and express it, that’s what this place is for. It is my opinion that if we treated each other with more respect we would have more common ground. It is not my intention to argue with you over your idealogy. I don’t think anything can be accomplished until we realize we are on the same team united against the current situation. In numbers we wouldn’t need violence IMHO
The OnePercent ***always*** win. That is how we got totally subjugated and this enslaved status. Did you have any doubt that this would turn out differently. I sure as hell had zero. none. nadda.
Move your money, advocate for state banks like your life depends on it, because it does, avoid debt like the plague, because it is a plague, support OWS. And protest the sham illegitimate election of OnePercenters by OnePercenters. Obama is no friend of the people and Republicans all work for the same people.
Maybe try reading this from someone who is more apt than myself to express it:
Wendy Davis addressed the question of which solutions work better than others in this MyFDL diary: http://my.firedoglake.com/wendydavis/2012/02/06/non-violence-or-diversity-of-tactics-confronting-the-myth-of-the-rational-insurgent/
“Though it defies consensus, between 1900 and 2006, campaigns of nonviolent resistance were more than twice as effective as their violent counterparts. Attracting impressive support from citizens that helps separate regimes from their main sources of power, these campaigns have produced remarkable results, even in the contexts of Iran, the Palestinian Territories, the Philippines, and Burma.
You got that right.
“Idea[o]logy”? Bloviating threats are just trash talk. Ain’t nunca gonna work.
Plus, I’m not on board with compradors, comrade.
There ain’t no such thing as a just capitalism, and you’re way too late if you think there is.
Don’t be ridiculous. It’s clear you’re not as clued in as the aborigines.
Look up.
Boink! Boink!
‘Cause y’all clearly love to learn the hard way.
No, really. I’ve been waiting a long time.
I’m waiting behind Door #1, too, honey!
SMACK. XXXOOO
Masoninblue is a nice person, too nice to give you the reply you deserve. I, OTOH, am just a middle-aged barbarian.
Obama is just a fascist with a smiling face. Romney is another. There is no difference. Newt is just a fascist with a scowling face. And if you are planning to vote for Obama, you’re just as bad as any of the above. And you are a threat to me and mine.
Riled up, yet? I quiver. Where’s my sword?
The cashless society is on the Fascist agenda. Big brother will know where you spend your digits. And if he thinks you are less than loyal he will simply close your account or “freeze your assets” as they say.
yah, I don’t know what to do about my situation. I refuse to talk to gmac (ally). I won’t refi with them. I will try to refinance through the hope project and have avoided hamp. I have equity in the house but I will not work with GMAC because they violated laws. They are criminals and if that makes me stupid so be it…I don’t trust them. I supposed I will try to get refinance through the hope project…if that doesn’t work, then I will quit making payments. I figure I can last another two or three years…since a refinance takes forever right now. Then they can foreclose and try to take my home…but you know..I might be able to file another chapter 13 by then! One day at a time, but how sad for America!
It doesn’t matter whether legitimate title companies do research. The chain of title has been destroyed by MERS because most of these transfers were never properly recorded. They don’t actually know WHO owns the property.