
Be very careful not to get cooped and don’t go home. Here as reported here by Tea Party Founder Karl Denninger by way of RT.
Karl Denninger was one of the founders of the Tea Party back just a few years ago when some concerned conservatives wanted to fire back at the government for what they said was unjust practices.
Today, similar sentiments are being echoed by the Occupy Wall Street movement.
Is it right to make comparisons between the two groups? Denninger says that, yes, to some degree the comparisons are indeed accurate. The Occupy movement, however, can learn from some of the mistakes that he says the Tea Party succumbed to.
“The problem with protests and the political process is that it is very easy, no matter how big the protests is, for the politicians to simply wait for the people to go home,” says Denninger. “Then they can ignore you.”
And this is the thing that happened in the 1960s with the anti-war movement. As soon as it looked like the war would end, everyone went home and forgot about it.
He goes on to say that the lack of a plan or demands is a good thing. Like the blog I did here.
“One of the things that the Occupy movement seems to have going for it is it has not turned around and issued a set of formal demands,” said Denninger. “This is a good thing, not a bad thing. Everyone is looking for a set of demands.” Denninger added that once the protesters formally approach the banks and government with a list of demands, “then somebody is going to say, ‘Well, we gave you 70 percent. Now go home.’”
In the case of the Tea Party, Denninger says such organization was actually the group’s downfall. “One of the things we wanted was the end to bailouts and an end to government deficit spending, and as you can see that didn’t happen,” said Denninger, who today manages The Market Ticker.
Denninger added that demonstrators with Occupy Wall Street and the offshoots across the world shouldn’t just abandon their goals. “Stay on message, which is that the corruption is not a singular event,” he said. “You can’t focus in one place. You have to get the money out of politics, which is very difficult to do, but at the same time you can’t silence people’s voice.”
Here is the video of the report.
And as reported here in Raw Story, Denninger is not happy with how the Tea Party got cooped by the republicans and the monied up interests.
“The problem with protests and the political process is that it is very easy, no matter how big the protest is, for the politicians to simply wait until the people go home,” financial blogger Karl Denninger observed. “And then they can ignore you.”
“Well, Occupy Wall Street was a little different,” he continued. “And back in 2008, I wrote that when we will actually see change is when the people come, they set up camp, and they refuse to go home. That appears to be happening now.”
Denninger has been complaining for some time that the Tea Party was hijacked by the Republican establishment and used to protect the very prople it had originally opposed. A year ago, he wrote, “Tea Party my ass. This was nothing other than the Republican Party stealing the anger of a population that was fed up with the Republican Party’s own theft of their tax money at gunpoint to bail out the robbers of Wall Street and fraudulently redirecting it back toward electing the very people who stole all the ****ing money!” [Emphasis mine]
Now he advises Occupy Wall Street, “Don’t let it happen.”



19 Comments

vey interesting, thanx cmaukonen. recc’d
Never heard of this guy before but never really picked up on who the leaders were besides the Ron Paul teapartiers once I heard the connex with Fox & the Armey camp et al had been revealed. Which was really early in 2009.
Good advice he seems to give, tho.
A friend found this opinion piece at Fox News; an excerpt:
“Most Tea Partiers understand. Government almost never acts alone. There’s an unholy alliance between those two bloated institutions that is responsible for many our problems today. As the voices of citizens are finally being raised effectively, neither institution deserves a free pass.
Over and over again, we’ve seen how intertwined Washington and Wall Street have become, each serving the other, each protecting its own. It make no sense to rail against TARP and the Wall Street bailouts without also targeting the big banks and others who soaked up all those millions in taxpayer funds.
They took our money and have given back precious little in return. Shouldn’t Citi, Bank of America, JP Morgan and the rest of these mega-sponges be taken to task as well?
That’s what the Wall Street protestors are pointing out in the name “the other 99 percent.” It’s a very Tea Party argument. The Tea Party should be helping to make the point.”
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/10/13/hey-tea-partiers-go-join-occupy-wall-street/#ixzz1arSMgXj2
A commenter on one of my diaries went a li’l crazy about the Harvard Constitutional Convention forum being co-chaired by Lawrence Lessig and the head of the Tea Party Patriots. There should be a point when we can simply seek common ground on the greater issue of plutocratic rule; and maybe the Tea people will eventually get that Big Government isn’t the problem, corrupt, bloated, permanantly-at-war government is.
Most people understand that the government never acts alone.
A couple of the more positive signs I have seen in this movement is the embrace of truly participatory democracy with the GA and the interest and support of grass roots community based solutions.
These are both very good things. And as the poster says in the blog I repeated here,
http://www.theonion.com/articles/nation-waiting-for-protesters-to-clearly-articulat,26353/
Well, he seems surprisingly reasonable.
Recommended.
The fact that R presidential candidates have said mildly positive things about sentiment behind #occupy (though not the DFH’s who are on the streets) should alert everyone to the possibility of an attempt to co-opt #occupy *from the right*.
As I’ve said before, the TP *was* making some similar complaints, and others have been arguing effectively that the false polarization we see in our government (the two parties are really very, very similar) is more of an effort at keeping the peeps divided while government lumbers on to benefit the 1%.
Thanks, cmaukonen.
The idea of TPers uniting with OWSers around any sort of program at all has to be a nightmare for Big Capital and their servants in Big Politics. For that matter, they were afraid of TPers alone; look how much money they spent to hijack the movement (or to keep it within bounds, if you prefer).
Once a transpartisan movement gains significant support around the idea that it’s all broken, that they won’t fix it, and that we can come up with something better, US politics will have entered a place where our MOTUs really, really don’t want to go, and we really, really do.
Recommended.
Please do keep up the good work cmaukonen. We the people should make it clear that what we seek is legitimate government and that we do not recognize, and therefore do not petition the lawless, authoritarian, usurpers who are temporarily in power. And we must reject any and all advances by the Democratic and Republican Parties. It is they who have ruined our country and forced us onto the streets.
I think Jest, that even the Onion will have a hard time satirizing a nation that is already mildly insane.
Well as has been reported else where – but not a great deal – was that the original Tea party movement came about right after TARP but was very quickly taken over by the republicans and southern bigots.
From the right? Democracy For America sent a fundraising e-mail to its subscriber list which strongly implied cooperation and shared goals between OWS (a dismorphous, non-centralized band of people with many different political beliefs, left to right) and DFA (a progressive organization, which I remain strongly skeptical about with respect to its relationship with the national Democratic Party). They are offering “OWS yard signs” in exchange for a donation of $16 or some such.
It was only at the end of the e-mail, after the signature and “thanks” that a post-script “our lawyers made us write this” noting that the fundraiser was for the DFA PAC–not the OWS movement. If a person didn’t read that P.S. at the end, the rest of the e-mail could easily have been signed by a legitimate OWS person soliciting for OWS donations.
The effort to coopt OWS is already well under way.
The “something better” can only be implemented by engaging the system itself, though (either through revolution or by voting for election reform and its siblings). Every week that the OWS movement continues without even beginning to organize around some set of concrete goals–even something as simple as “let’s all vote for somebody who isn’t R and isn’t D”–is another week of increased vulnerability to dismissal or attack from the entrenched powers that be.
Forcing people to pay attention is one thing, and arguably the most important. I’d argue OWS has the attention they wanted. The public has a notoriously short attention span, though. Without capitalizing on that, this movement is going to be coopted–or relegated to “ignore” status.
Almost makes one wonder if there might be more like him out there, huh?
Yes. Very early in the Tea Party movement, it was more grass roots and the concerns were about TARP bail-outs, etc. It was very quickly co-opted by the Kochs, who used Fox & Rush Limbaugh & Dick Armey to “manage” it into something that the PTB could “use” for their own purposes and ends.
That’s why a lot of Tea Party citizens feel aggrieved when told that their movement is astro-turfed. I “get” that they may have their own true feelings about what they’re doing, but unfortunately their movement, for better or worse, has been bought off by the Kochs and co-opted.
And there will be more of that happening, for sure.
I have been following Karl Denninger for years (http://market-ticker.org/)
He accurately predicted the 2008 market collapse a year or more before it happened; and he wasn’t the only one to do so.
Here is a video he made in September 2008, before the passage of TARP, excoriating Paulson.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO6P_yjKFR4
I know.
At some point, they’ll have to stop calling it satire, and just call it news.
Interesting. Recommended. But remember that the antiwar protests of the Sixties and 1970 stopped just as soon as Nixon ended the draft. All of the sudden, the Baby Boomers were no longer in jeopardy of being drafted and sent off to war, and they dropped the whole antiwar and anti-establishment thing just like that.
I remember. I was only about 11 years old when it happened, but I remember. My older cousins who had taken to the streets and hidden in the Rockies or Mexico all of the sudden came home and didn’t even want to talk about what they had been so outspoken about just a year before. They had gotten what THEY wanted, and no longer cared about the others who were still fighting in Vietnam. Oh, I remember that clearly.
Then many of them, who had so strongly supported the protesters in Chicago in 1968 and been teargassed themselves on college campuses, voted for Nixon in 1972. That is when I learned what “hypocrisy” meant.
HA…don’t get me started on that one. I know exactly what you mean.