The House’s passage of the Waxman-Markey bill raises the possibility that the United States will finally do something on global warming. This prospect has the industry hacks screaming at top volume about the horrible fate that awaits the economy. Everyone should know not to take them seriously, as I will explain in a moment.
First, we should acknowledge the obvious: The bill is awful. It gives away permits to greenhouse gas emitters that should instead be auctioned. As a result, money that could be rebated to taxpayers or used to fund the development of clean technologies instead goes to the industries that are the source of the problem.
Second, the use of tradable permits rather than a tax is a rather questionable policy. Permits will almost certainly require more government enforcement bureaucracy than a system of taxes and subsidies. And, incidentally, permits will allow Goldman Sachs and our other Wall Street friends to make tens of billions of dollars on trading fees in the coming decades, a high priority for all Americans.
But a bad bill is almost certainly better than no bill. If Waxman-Markey doesn’t get through, it is very difficult to see another bill getting through this Congress. And there is no reason to believe that the Congress that gets elected in 2010 will be any less indebted to the corporate lobbyists.
The Waxman-Markey bill should be viewed as a foot in the door. It is a modest first step toward reducing greenhouse gas emissions that both demonstrates a commitment and provides an opportunity to show the public that emissions can be lowered without imposing an enormous economic burden on the country.
Of course, the only reason that so many people believe that reducing greenhouse gas emissions will impose an enormous burden on the economy is that the oil and coal industry, and their friends in the media, have been pushing this tripe for more than a decade. The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) projects that the cost of the Waxman-Markey bill at $22 billion a year in 2020. That will be equal to less than 0.1 percent of projected GDP in that year, or about $70 out of the pocket of each person in the country.
The coal and oil companies are greatly anguished over this prospective burden on American families, but let’s compare this burden to the burden posed by Iraq war levels of defense spending. Two years ago, the Center for Economic and Policy Research commissioned Global Insight to use its model to project the economic impact of Iraq war levels of military spending. They projected the effect on the economy of a sustained increase in defense spending equal to 1.0 percent of GDP, an amount slightly less than the increase sustained in the years following the start of the Afghanistan and Iraq wars.
Global Insight was selected because it is one of the oldest econometric forecasting firms in the country. Its model has been widely used for a wide variety of analyses and it certainly is not associated with progressive or anti-defense politics. Its model is also very much in the mainstream of the economics profession. It will not produce results that are qualitatively different than any other mainstream model.
The model projected that after 10 years of higher spending, GDP would be down by about $17 billion from baseline levels. After 20 years (2021 if defense spending stays high), GDP would be down by more than $60 billion from baseline levels, approximately three times CBO’s projection of the cost of the Waxman-Markey bill.
Of course, these projections don’t show the full loss to households, since they don’t include the money that must be diverted from taxes or obtained by borrowing to support the higher level of defense spending. These figures are just the lost output.
Global Insight projected that after 20 years of higher defense spending, annual car sales would be down by more than 700,000. Housing starts would be almost 40,000 lower. Exports would be 1.8 percent lower and imports would be 2.7 percent higher, leading to a trade deficit that would be almost $200 billion larger. The model also projected that there would be nearly 700,000 fewer jobs as a result of the higher level of defense spending.
In short, the economic harm projected from high levels of military spending is far larger than the damage projected from the Waxman-Markey bill. Given this situation, we would have expected that all the oil and coal industry folks, who are now so concerned about the average family’s well-being, would have been screaming about the economic pain that would result from sustaining the Iraq war levels of military spending.
Did anyone ever hear them raise this issue? Does anyone recall members of Congress giving speeches about how the job loss from the Iraq war levels of spending would be devastating? Does anyone recall any newspaper columns or editorials making this point? How about a news story that analyzed the economic impact of higher levels of military spending?
For some reason, job loss and economic pain associated with the military are just not worth mentioning. These items only become newsworthy when the issue is saving the environment. And the elites wonder why the public has so little confidence in the country’s institutions.



23 Comments







Thanks Dean
Thanks, Dean. *sigh*
Dean, I was educated to be an electrical engineer.
FWIW, I know theoretically how complex it is to analyze multiple body problems. Just about impossible, if not impossible.
How can you believe in the GW believers? I know, I do. Because I want to protect planet Earth. Seriously. But do the GW believers have the math and science right? I want to believe they do. Because I love our planet. But I think they’re out to lunch.
As an engineer you should understand a factor of safety. Given the data and the extent of it if some of the data is in fact erroneous the preponderence of the evidence should still require action.
Yes, safety factors, or regret. Never seen a proof, but I’ll bet that the optimal safety factor under uncertainty is consistent with the minimum regret.
And, per Dean’s explanation of the reasons for choosing the model that was used, one thing about which we have relatively little uncertainty is that the economic costs of action against global warming are smaller than those of other actions that some of us laud.
Why?
Because emotion is not the same as math and science.
I was sincere in my question. Specifically what is troubling you? I am genuinely not following your argument and am hoping you can be more precise so I can understand you better.
Let’s say you have three bodies.
Each acting with forces upon each other.
Can you analyze (predict) their motions?
Good luck.
Same with climate change.
Let’s put three Republicans on Sunday television, one on Face the Nation, one on GPS, one on Meet the Press. All talk about Health Care legislation. I predict none will support a public option which includes all of (1) national and available everywhere (2) govt appointed and accountable (3) with bargaining clout, and (4) available on day one.
I can’t predict where they’ll sit, or what colour tie they’ll wear, or whether they’ll say “you’re such a dick” to the Democrat sitting next to them as the credits roll. But I can predict those Republicans won’t support a public health care option from day one as outlined above.
ART45, I’m familiar with the 3 body gravitational problem in physics. I’m still not exactly sure what you’re getting at. So let me start over. Here is your original comment that I didn’t understand:
Ok, so you took physics, hence the 3-body analogy. Next:
This is where you lose me. I do not know who you are referring to as “GW believers” (the public, politicians, scientists, DFHs?). Is it that you do not “believe” that humans have an effect on our planetary system (hence your use of the term “GW believers”)? What specific “math and science” is worrying you: the current state of the system or future predictions? You seem to be under the impression that earth sciences are a matter of faith and belief rather than careful scientific study, which is puzzling to say the least. Who specifically (again: scientists, politicians, the public?) is “out to lunch” and on what basis do you make that assertion?
Is it that you think earth scientists are incapable of modeling chemistry and physics? Do you think our understanding of the current system is wrong/inadequate? Or is it just that you think it is impossible to predict the future response of the planet to current and estimated future changes?
Your original comment was sufficiently vague, that I do not know how to appropriately respond, because I don’t know what it is that concerns you. The 3-body problem from physics suggests your concern is related to our ability to predict the future, but it would help if I knew exactly who and what you think is “out to lunch”.
I think you’ve been conned. This is what you get instead of taking action. It’s like you know you have to do something, so you put something cosmetic forward and pretend that you’re fixing the problem. It would be great if this was the first step to real action. However, I think it is actually all you are going to do.
Isn’t this the way all these “reform” bills are going?
i’m not sure a bad bill is better than no bill. at least with no bill there would still be some pressure to act. this bill looks like a recipe for ecological disaster, even if sold as “progress.”
have the Ds have joined with the Rs in the war on science?
I suspect it is simply a case where the Ds have bellied up to the same corporate trough as the Rs looking for campaign handouts.
I agree with selise and Dennis Kucinich on this one: if there is no bill, the Democrats, who were elected to fix things, have their incompetence on display, so there is still hope. A bad bill gives them cover, and you can be sure that there’ll be no further action.
Per Joe Buck’s Dkos diary:
Per Hugh on Sunday:
We don’t have the luxury of time. This is a do or die effort and half measures don’t cut it any more.
I don’t think I will be asking either of my AR Dem senators to vote for this. I won’t get involved one way or another… Sometimes a foot in the door is just asking for a sore toe. This bill isn’t worth the effort, and I don’t want to even appear to be supporting big coal or more Goldman funding.
somewhere i read that the big detriment of this bill is to take enforcement out of the hands of the epa. does anyone know anything about this?
Watch Fox and Larry Elder spew propaganda about cap and trade.
http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=1973
ART45, if you had gone to the trouble of studying differential equations, you would have learned that not all of them are of the same difficulty. If you believe solar and lunar eclipses can be predicted, then you must realize that closed form solutions of the differential equations governing n-body problems are not required for practical purposes. If you had taken the trouble to study a bit of the physics of climate science, you might have been able to make a valid point instead of arguing from ignorance.
Second that. Seriously, ART45, when were you educated as an electrical engineer? If you’ve kept up with the field even as far as twenty years ago, surely you understand that it is possible to construct an accurate computer model for conditions far more complex than those where a complete closed-form solution is known — it’s done on a daily basis in chip and circuit design. So what is the difficulty with accepting that the same can be done for climate systems. (And if you’re inclined to bring up testing, remember that the engineering models weren’t constructed by trial and error.)
The IPCC process is required to only accept projections where the participants believe there is greater than 90% likelihood that conditions will be at least that bad, that is, it errs on the conservative side. That’s why with nearly every revision, the projected results are worse.
So what’s your basis for doubting it?
I’m not sure there’s any evidence here that ART45 is ignorant as such, but there does seem to be a questionable parallelism at work there. Even if the chemistry, thermodynamics, etc. analysis were equally as complex and nigh-insoluble as the harder 3-body gravitation problems — and I don’t have enough info to judge whether that is or is not so — that would only serve to discounts all such analysis of the problem, not just pro-warming analyses but both the pro-warming and the anti-warming analyses. You don’t get to cancel just one side of the argument when you attack the common basis of climate analysis, instead you would have to deem the whole question unanswerable. Merely presuming that nothing is changing would be a scoundrel’s dodge, a tautology, so, once you were to arrive at a conclusion that the question of whether warming is actually taking place or not is unanswerable, then it would seem that the admonition to, at a minimum, do no harm would kick in. Bringing us back full circle to: acting now.
Do you really want to know what Obama is up to with Cap and Trade? In his own words “this will make electric rates sky rocket”. Stop burying your head in the sand and watch this video clip. http://hotair.com/archives/200…..ent-page-2
When did he lie to us? Now or last year?