There are many people in the country that have very little understanding of economics. As an economist, I would like to see everyone be at least somewhat literate in the area, but this is the way of the world. It’s not really that big of a problem in most cases, but it is when they write pieces on economic policy for the New York Times.
Yes, Thomas Friedman is at it again, bemoaning the fact that President Obama hasn’t embraced the big cuts to Social Security and Medicare proposed by former senator Alan Simpson and Morgan Stanley director Erskine Bowles. (Friedman wrongly attributes the proposals to the commission that they co-chaired. The commission did not produce a report, Friedman is referring to the proposals of the co-chairs.)
The Simpson-Bowles plan is great if you think the country’s biggest problem is high-living seniors. Of course very few people from any political perspective accept this view. Even large majorities of Republicans and self-identified conservatives oppose cuts to Social Security and Medicare. In fact, almost no one other than the Wall Street gang and people who write columns for the New York Times and Washington Post support cuts to these programs. This probably explains why President Obama did not follow Friedman’s advice and embrace the Simpson-Bowles plan.
This is a matter of personal taste, some folks think that the best way to address whatever budget problems we might have is to fix the broken health care system, tax Wall Street, and place the burden on the big winners in the economy over the last three decades (i.e. the one percent). Then you have people like Thomas Friedman who think its better to take money from seniors with a median income of $31,400.
But once we get beyond the questions of taste, we have Friedman’s economics. He quotes Maya MacGuineas, the president of the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget:
” . . . a free-standing stimulus that is not combined with a credible multiyear plan that truly stabilizes our fiscal imbalances would not solve our problems, …. because if nobody knows what is waiting around the corner, after the stimulus runs out,’ many people will just take that money and stuff it in a mattress rather than in investments or spending.”
Okay, so the argument here is that we will see high savings rates and low investment spending as long as we don’t have a credible deficit plan. Let’s think about this one for a moment. How many people are basing their decision on whether to take a vacation or buy a car on the government’s deficit prospects for 2020?
I don’t know many people who think this way, but let’s suppose that my friends are atypical. Suppose that people are worried that come 2020 we will have some big tax increase because something really bad happens in the world due to our runaway deficits. Wouldn’t it make sense for people to invest and make money now, since the future could be bad news?
Or, to take the other side of the coin, suppose that we all knew that our Social Security benefits will be lower 10 years from now due to the Bowles-Simpson cuts and that we will have to pay more for our health care because of cuts to Medicare. Wouldn’t we then decide that we better save more (i.e. spend less) so that we would have more money to support ourselves in retirement? Doesn’t that go the wrong way if the point is stimulus?
Maybe logic isn’t Friedman’s strong suit. Let’s just look at the evidence. If we buy the Friedman story, then investment and consumption should be low today since people are worried about the deficits ten years out. Unfortunately the data do not support Friedman’s story. Investment in equipment and software is nearly back to its pre-recession level measured as a share of GDP. This is pretty impressive, since there are huge amounts of excess capacity in large sectors on the economy. (Firms tend not to invest much when they already have more capacity than they need.)
The saving rate in the most recent quarter was under 5.0 percent. This compares with a post-war, pre-bubble, average of more than 8 percent. This suggests that, contrary to Freidman’s economics, people are not putting money under their mattress, they are actually spending at a pretty good rate.
But so what if Friedman’s got no theory and no evidence? That is no excuse not to be cutting Social Security and Medicare.



52 Comments

I assume that’s a rhetorical statement as there is no “maybe” about it – it can be stated as a simple declarative statement of fact.
driftglass is going to go nuts.
“Maybe logic isn’t Friedman’s strong suit.”
Frank Zappa had an answer to Friedman’s ‘logic’.
“Look here brother, who you jivin’ with that cosmic debris?”
That Friedman is an idiot is evident to anyone who isn’t.
That said, IMO this brief critique:
…would be even better if it included at least a mention of our incredibly-bloated “defense” budget, too.
Thanks, Dean.
Friedman has always come across to me as a very, very overpaid motivational speaker who does the high-end dinner party circuit.
I’ve been speaking on the value and economic impact of various actions for 50 years – usually finding my “results oriented” bosses – the result wanted being they or a friend get something – have a way of finding a “logic” to convince their boss that I and those trained like myself are to be ignored.
I thought it amazing that US companies did relatively well in the world until I worked for French, Dutch, and Brits who did not even allow 5 years of good profitable advice (that seems the standard in the US before the legacy kid bosses do a replacement of the good advice givers) with those EU bosses removing some friends working with me and in one case removing myself in the first 24 months. There is hope for Canada, which for some reason seems to value trained folk more, but even there the power/greed thing gets in play now and then.
MSNBC never challenges Friedman, or allows a Krugman time to fully respond to his foolish uninformed comments. The media can not call a lie a lie – ever – and especially when the liar is one of their own.
The only logical path out of this mess is keeping the trigger defense cuts plus return of all of the Clinton rates plus further cuts to defense and plus the end of the use of contractors in lieu of Federal workers plus single payer health with a Maryland type reimb setting board for all 3rd party payers of health claims, all with the end of corporate welfare via contracts and tax provisions.
I wonder if we will ever follow the logical path rather than some half-wits favorite thought of the day.
I see him basically as a high-school math teacher who watches CNN.
That man makes me wonder whether I should shave my moustache.
You have to wonder what Friedman does in his spare time. Is he a golfer? He clearly doesn’t read much any more, since he continually makes egregious errors of facts (he ought to afford himself at least an intern fact-checker). I actually think he probably plays with himself when he is not fingering his keyboard. It’s hard otherwise to explain his ignorance.
“Okay, so the argument here is that we will see high savings rates and low investment spending as long as we don’t have a credible deficit plan. … I don’t know many people who think this way …”
Try the POTUS.
Hell, he doesn’t hold a candle to Billy Kristol as far as being wrong about virtually everything he pontificates about.
That’s a pretty high bar but he’s within striking distance
Kristol is the patron saint of wrongness.
The Earl of Error — LOLOL
Dean Baker, 2011: “[S]pending cuts and tax increases slow growth by pulling money out of the economy.”
I wish every American understood this.
I wish Obama knew it
;-) The Duke of Dumbness lol. Happy Thanksgiving to you, eb.
Happy T-Day
Bah! You naysayers will all see. Two or three ‘Friedman Units” after we cut SS and Medicare, the heavens will rain prosperity down upon us. (By the way, wasn’t ‘Friedman Unit’ coined her at FDL?)
Don’t be so hard on Friedman. He lives in this humble shack on the wrong side of the tracks (http://bit.ly/v48SbL). As such, my guess is that he can’t afford to hire the researchers who would lend weight and substance to his deep thoughts about the economy.
Friedman is the epitome of a phat ass know nothing 1%er.
Guess i wont be getting that new vacuum cleaner. Will use all the dust bunnies to fill the hole in the mattress where the money was.
In your support I say this:
Define the symbols; G=govt spending per year
I=gross investment per year
C=private consumption per year
X=export/year
M=import/year
By definition GDP = C+I+G+(X-M) = 5G( empirically using US data from 1969 to 20100), which means C+I+X-M = 4G. If G decreases, you have to import more, export less,invest less or consume less or a combination of all. This is an accounting identity and has nothing to do with any ideology. If G increases, C+I+X-M will increase and USA will become prosperous again.
I added a diagram in
http://pshakkottai.wordpress.com/2011/11/23/how-the-econom…orks-a-diagram/ to explain MMT and show how real economy works.
The plot showing GDP = 5G is at
http://pshakkottai.wordpress.com/2011/10/16/us-gdp-vs-govt-spending-2/
Yes, I think it was coined here. At least, I first read it here. I think Friedman Unit = two weeks.
Friedman is a “curb side dweller” when viewed from folks like myself here in the Sonoran Desert. Invariably, we, the “racial and ethnics” continue to kick Friedman further onto the curb for his inexactitude, and which means that we have given up on the New York Times, Washington Post, and the Wall Street Journal.
And lest I forget, Dr. Baker, continue your ‘take downs’ of Friedman, Brooks, and Samuelson, among others.
Jaango
FU = 6 months, coined by Atrios.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedman_(unit)
He made me wonder the same thing! So now I have a beard :)
Two weeks? Good golly Ms. Molly! I got off my lazy butt and googled it. Apparently credit goes to Atrios and it means a six month interval into the future, originally dealing with military plans for the failures in Iraq but now useful for anything that Friedman puts into print.
Ducktree — great minds, etc.
Make mine a perfect gin martini, with an orange twist please! (;>
Passing one to you right now via these inter-tubes.
Baker was not referring to taxes increases on the wealthy, Tyler, but to those on the middle class. It has been a constant theme of his, as has the need to INCREASE taxes on the wealthy.
Once again, you have quoted an economist out of context, which you regularly do, in trying to prove your unprovable case against taxing the rich.
If Baker was referring only to tax increases on the wealthy, he would have said so in the very sentence I quoted.
Good luck at trying to destroy my reputation. You’re only destroying yours.
Correction: If Baker was referring only to tax increases on the middle class, he would have said so in the very sentence I quoted.
No, he wouldn’t have! It’s called English Composition, Tyler, and it’s why books, news articles, and yes, economists’ columns consist of MULTIPLE SENTENCES. Look at Baker’s body of work and you’ll see that he STRONGLY SUPPORTS tax increases on the rich.
You are purposely misrepresenting Baker’s beliefs, just as you did James Galbraith’s, in the out-of-context quote linked to in my prior comment. When you read the full column, it’s plain Galbraith supports higher taxes on the rich, despite your attempt to say the opposite is true.
Keep it up, and you’ll have some noted economists extremely pissed off at you. You’re not fooling anyone.
Lord, what an architectural disaster the Chateau Friedman is. Isn’t that a port-á-cochère over part of the oval driveway there? (The light gray, as contrasted with the darker gray elsewhere.) Um, Tommy, the whole point of a port-á-cochère is that it extends the roofline, so that people debarking from their vehicles can enter the building without getting rained on. See this picture ( http://i792.photobucket.com/albums/yy204/sdelacruz67/port-a-cochere.jpg ) for an example.
Constructing a free-standing port-á-cochère 30 feet from the house makes “the kind of sense that’s not”, to quote a well-known werewolf. So your guests can now get out of their cars without getting rained on…and then they have to sprint up the front walk to the door in the rain, is that the idea? Wotta maroon.
(That dead zone around the pool, poolhouse, and cabana is pretty ugly, too. If you don’t want trees dropping leaves in your pool [because you don't know how to use a skimmer?] then plant some bushes, or some grass or something. Right now it looks like you built the pool complex in the middle of a freshly-plowed field. And can we discuss the u-g-l-y parking lot/garage right in the middle of the east wing? “Tradesmens’ Entrances” are around the side, or in the back, not right out front where everyone can see. You’ve completely spoiled the line of the front of the house. Sheesh.)
Thomas Friedman. So stupid he can’t even do obscene wealth correctly. Gah.
Am I crazy, or does Tommy look a little like Uncle Joe in that picture? Compare:
http://media.weirdworm.com/img/people/fun-facts-about-dictators/josef-stalin.jpg
that boy has stupid written all over him.
lest we forget, SS and Medicare have been in the cross hairs of the right since they were passed. it is an amazing stroke of luck for righties that there is a situation capable of being amped up to a ‘crisis’, then used to achieve goals they have had for decades.
why, the Great Recession is almost as nice as Terrorism, when you think about it. if you are a sociopathic greed head.
Yes, it looks a little like the Winchester Mystery House, doesn’t it?
Hmmm….
I thought whenever Friedman did anything wrong it would always be the WSJ or Weekly Standard on his case the firstest and fastest.
But wait, look at that picture of Friedman above. He looks like a Very Serious Person. Doesn’t that mean something to y’all.
Seriously, when I read this column of his last night, I almost puked. Fortunately, I only read Friedman on an empty stomach.
The actual formula at work here is
A) X and Y
B) ???
C) Cut Social Security and Medicare
oh shit now i see why we have to cut SS and Medicare.
do you think Tommy F would have brians to figure that having Erskine Bowles involved with cutting SS Medicare Medicaid while heading up Moegan Stanley is a big conflict of interest but I guess not
Dean…saw you on the DR show and thanks for pushing back on Peter M about SS! keep up the good work!
not really sure why this jackass Friedman is in the New York times at all. he’s gotta have some naked pictures of someone, is all I can figure.
you’d think the times would look around and say “yeah, most every newspaper in this country is really a piece of shit, and we could really fill a huge void and prosper if we had great columnists across the board, no dipshits who make shit up out of thin air.”
I’ve started going to The Guardian (from England, it’s one of their biggest papers, still family owned). Their business section will tell you more truth about our economy than you can find in our corporate media. I’d put the link here, but I don’t think that’s allowed on FDL ?
nice work, Mr. Baker, thanks for reading and holding a light up to Tommy Boy’s vapid stream of nonsense.
I saw him once on Charlie Rose show. what a corporate lovefest that was, between Charlie having multiple orgasms while discussing the god-like CEO of some criminal NY bank, and Tommy Boy using some weird corporate-speake to solve the entire planet’s problems because he, well, basically knows all things, I though to myself, “wow, I think I’m going to puke any second now.”
fortunately I got the channel changed in the nick of time and my nausea subsided to a manageable level.
good thing Friedman lives in this super duper large scale mansion, it gives his family plenty of places to hide from him.
I have quoted no economist out of context. You’re just frustrated that both Galbraith and Baker have stated that tax increases slow growth.
Baker clearly stated that tax increases and spending cuts slow growth. Please accept that raising taxes on anyone is bad for the economy. I know this kills your dream of raising taxes on the rich, but it’s important to accept reality.
You’re being as close-minded as a Fox News viewer.
Perfect example of the ‘useful idiot’.
Yes, and he was referring to middle class tax increases and consumer spending, you idiot. What part don’t you understand?
He was stating the basic economic fact that tax increases slow growth! Maybe if you had a college degree, you would understand this.
You are a fucking piece of shit who believes what you want to believe, regardless of how false it is. You remind me of most Americans.
Do the world a favor and drop dead!
Everyone, consider the irony of a guy who says “there is no such thing as government spending” calling someone other than himself an idiot! Anthony, tell the truth: you joined the Tea Party thinking there was free tea in it for you.
Good luck finding a job, Anthony, but the sad truth is that employers aren’t hiring morons at the moment.