14 Responses to This is not America!

1. wigwam February 13th, 2009 at 5:27 am «

   President Barack Obama 2/9/09:

   My view is also that nobody is above the law, and if there are clear instances of wrongdoing, that people should be prosecuted just like any ordinary citizen …

   This diary presents “clear instances of wrongdoing.” So bring on the prosecution.

   As I’ve said in the comments of two other diaries, the Supremacy Clause of Article VI makes ratified treaties binding law, and those ratified treaties require us to prosecute or extradite those accused of torture, no exceptions. Either President Obama is going to fulfill his constitutional obligation to “take care that the laws be faithfully executed” or he is not, in which case, he should be impeached in order to encourage future presidents to read their job description and take it seriously.
2. perris February 13th, 2009 at 5:29 am «

   I agree, that was not america and if obama does not do something about these crimes then he is not my president, then he is as guilty as those initiating, endorsing and engaging in acts against this country, her constitution, our children and grandchildren, our national security for generations to unknown, costs untold

   great post madness of dog
3. Jim White February 13th, 2009 at 6:24 am «

   Thanks for this, MadDog. Here is more on the business of the chains attached to the ceilings courtesy of ondelette at Humanity Against Crimes:

   While waterboarding has grabbed all the attention, and is without a doubt cruel treatment amounting to torture, this “high cuffing” or “Palestinian Hanging” has plenty of documentation, and no one has claimed that it has been performed on only 3 “high-valued detainees”. There is picture after picture of this position at Abu Ghraib. It is uniformly referred to in administration documents as a stress posture.

   It is a modification of an Inquisitional technique called strappado. Strappado, and its more brutal cousin squassation, were the most used of torture techniques by the Spanish Inquisition because they were cheap and easy to do: throw a rope over a rafter, tie the prisoner’s wrists behind his/her back, and hoist them into the air by their wrists. It becomes squassation when the prisoner is then dropped by slackening the rope and then caught by tightening it. This causes dislocation of the shoulders, and the Inquisitors found that it generally caused death in about 3 to 4 drops. Strappado, without the drops, causes nerve damage in about 15 minutes. Darius Rejali notes that, “The strappado can easily dislocate the shoulders and maim victims permanently. However, the same approximate condition can be achieved, without overall damage and for a longer period of time, by raising the handcuffed hands behind the back until the prisoner is standing on his toes; his hands are then attached to a hook.” (Rejali, Torture and Democracy, p. 296). Or maybe a bed frame, or a bar in a prison window.
4. KiwiJackson February 13th, 2009 at 7:40 am «

   Your links are a must read. I’m forwarding them on to many.
   Thanks for posting this, MadDog.
5. ArlaMiner February 13th, 2009 at 8:03 am «

   Just something that jumped out at me and kind of blew the entire article for me:

   Both detainees were determined to have been killed by blood clots that were dislodged and travelled to their hearts, causing pulmonary embolism.

   Pulmonary embolism is a blood clot in the artery of a LUNG – not the heart. I’ve had pulmonary embolism, so I know wherefrom I speak. When something like this is in a “shock piece” (truthful or not), its innacuracy lessens the impact of any future statements (regardless of veracity) for me.
• robspierre February 13th, 2009 at 9:25 am «

  I’m not the right kind of doctor, but doesn’t a blod clot in the legs have to travel back to the heart in order to end up in the lungs? If it lodged in the leg and stayed there, it wouldn’t be immediately life threatening.
• MadDog February 13th, 2009 at 9:50 am «

  I can only conclude that the ACLU, whose actual comment you’re critizing, didn’t get the cause of death medical detail “exactly right”.

  As the ACLU writer was probably not an MD, one might cut them some slack. People make simple mistakes, so I wouldn’t (and don’t) consider this evidence of something more mendacious.

  And you yourself may not have got it “exactly right”. Here’s what the definition of pulmonary embolism is from Wiki:

  Pulmonary embolism (PE) is a blockage of the pulmonary artery or one of its branches, usually occurring when a deep vein thrombus (blood clot from a vein) becomes dislodged from its site of formation and travels, or embolizes, to the arterial blood supply of one of the lungs.

  (My Bold)

  Based on that definition, the blockage is not in the lung, but in the pulmonary artery (or branch) itself.

  I hope you’re not one to allow a minor wording error to deter you from seeing the truth, but if so, that would be a bigger mistake IMHO than the one the ACLU writer made.

  The “facts” are that the detainee described died from the torture policies promulgated at the highest levels of our government.

  As to the “veracity” of this “shock piece”, you can read the Army’s Medical Examiner’s autopsy report yourself since it is included as one of those “1649″ pages.
6. BooRadley February 13th, 2009 at 8:31 am «

   digg is open.

   Thanks MD.
7. robspierre February 13th, 2009 at 9:23 am «

   I have less and less hope that civilian/political leadership will do anything about the outrages of the last 8 years, given the mix of cowardice, incomprehension, and ignorance that surrounds torture in civilian circles.

   At least the CID reports exist–that in itself is testimony to the continued presence of honorable men and women in our armed forces. It could not have been popular or easy to carry out and document a conscientious investigation in the face of a chain of command determined to thwart justice.

   That’s why we need to continue to rage against the politicians until they do the necessary. We owe nothing less to those who take up the profession of arms and defend the Constitution honorably.
8. Hugh February 13th, 2009 at 2:38 pm «

   I meant to thank you for all the work you did on this piece. It is a really important issue. I agree this is not who we should be. But I don’t know that our political elites see it this way.
• MadDog February 13th, 2009 at 5:23 pm «

  I appreciate your thanks!
9. Fern February 13th, 2009 at 4:12 pm «

   What do you mean when you say this is not America?
• MadDog February 13th, 2009 at 5:22 pm «

  Twofold answer:

  As I wrote in the start of this piece and modify here for clarity’s sake:

  This song was These facts were never about disbelief and denial. No, this was instead a shameful dirge and a lament for what we really are.

  I meant for folks who saw the phrase “this is not America” to reach the conclusion that after reading this piece, “this is America!”

  Not that those of us with ethics would “wish” this to be the case, but a recognition that our “wishes” clash with reality.
10. Jim White February 14th, 2009 at 7:27 pm «

    I just got home from a concert where I was treated to a live performance of “This is not America” by the Ahn Trio in their first appearance with The Kin. It was an outstanding concert, but this song had special meaning because of this post.