The most obvious way Social Security is like a pension plan is that the rich are trying to destroy it, just like Hostess Brands wrecked the retirement plans of its bakers. But there are other similarities. Since 1983, we have all paid in a lot more money in FICA taxes than needed to fund current payments on the theory that it would be there for baby boomers when it was needed.
Pension plans do the same thing. They use actuarial calculations to figure out how much money they need in out years, and how much they need to take in today to make those payments. Then they invest the money as safely as possible so that it will be there when it is needed. The Social Security Trust Fund was ordered to use the excess contributions to buy Treasury obligations, albeit of a type supposedly not to be sold to the public. Those obligations are the bulwark of the demands of citizens who don’t want to see any more cuts to Social Security. They also constitute a partial explanation for the desire of the rich to cut Social Security: the bonds will have to be redeemed, meaning either the Treasury will have to sell bonds to replace them or we will have to increase taxes to fund the repayment of the bonds, or some other step will be necessary that the rich don’t like.
The deep desire not to pay the bonds is part of a longer term project, tax reduction for the rich. In fact, the use of the Special Treasury Obligation/Trust Fund was meant to disguise the reality of the huge tax cuts handed to the wealthy in the 1980s in a lovely bipartisan way. The unfairness and stupidity of the tax cut for the rich was hidden by the increase in the FICA taxes imposed only on income from work, and only modestly affecting the income of the rich. Meanwhile, the rich funded the increasing Reagan deficits by lending money to the Treasury that should have been paid in taxes.
Congress adopted a unified budget approach that folded the increased FICA taxes into the revenue side, making budget deficits seem much smaller than they actually were. (That was theoretically changed in 1990; see this for details of the current situation.) Now that it’s time to pay off the bonds held by the Trust Fund, the richest Americans have made their position clear: they aren’t paying back those bonds, and they won’t pay more taxes. They get support from their servant think tanks, like this from Jagadeesh Gokhale at the Koch Cato Institute:
Let us recognize that past excess payroll taxes relative to benefit outlays (past Trust Fund surpluses under the “off budget” perspective) have been spent on other government programs. Grants of additional spending authority for Social Security must ultimately be paid out of today’s and future taxpayer resources so making them whole is not really possible.
Gokhale says that the bonds held by the Trust Fund are like corporate borrowings, where the proceeds are used for corporate purposes. When due, they are either are paid from future income and assets, or are dumped in the trash through bankruptcy or negotiations with creditors. Let’s default, he says. He might want to check out the Fourteenth Amendment.
But the richest Americans plan to act on Gokhale’s advice. They are going to cut the retirement benefits of millions of fellow citizens rather than pay more taxes. And they have their hired hands in government to make that stick. Here’s their pet Senator, Mitch McConnell:
Predictably, the President is already claiming that his tax hike on the “rich” isn’t enough. I have news for him: the moment that he and virtually every elected Democrat in Washington signed off on the terms of the current arrangement, it was the last word on taxes. That debate is over. Now the conversation turns to cutting spending on the government programs that are the real source of the nation’s fiscal imbalance.
Where does that leave people dependent on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid? The Center for Retirement Research at Boston College recently issued an update on its retirement risk index. Here is the conclusion:
The NRRI shows that, as of 2010, more than half of today’s households will not have enough retirement income to maintain their pre-retirement standard of living, even if they work to age 65 – which is above the current average retirement age – and annuitize all of their financial assets, including the receipts from a reverse mortgage on their homes.
President Obama sees himself as a moderate Republican. He thinks that if half of the families in the country can’t maintain their standard of living in retirement, they should simply substitute a less pleasant life. They could, for example, live on a moderate amount of catfood, which is the logical substitute for tuna fish under his Chained CPI proposal. The Republicans in the House and Senate have a counteroffer: the old should die in the street. I’m sure there is a compromise for this infinitely flexible President: maybe we can set up Federal Die-In Locations so the rich won’t have to see the dead.




94 Comments

You getting closer, comrade.
Capitalism is fraud.
Thanks. That chart on page 6 is a whopper, showing cumulative effects of declining interest rates, housing values, lowered retirement age (?). For many folks, Social Security is the only secure asset they possess.
Munnell seemed to estimate a 4.6% return through an making an annuity of all assets. That seemed more than two times as high as the return on current fixed rate annuities. I wonder how she arrived at that number?
**corrections: higher retirement age instead of lowered retirement age, for that chart on page 6 of Munnell’s report. Sorry about that.
The PTB know that were in for systemic collapse due to environmental degradation and sooner then anyone ever dreamed ( within 30 yrs. not by 2100 or later.) The President has read the top secret memos from the NSA and the rest of the secret Gov’t. He knows damn well the game is up and collapse and massive disruption lies directly ahead. So why fund SSI, Medicare etc., especially when you need this $$ for making sure that the 1% et al. are defended, no matter what. Cynical? LOL you thunk, actually no, rational from their pt. of view. Why waste valuable resources on dead people?
I was with you until the last partagraph. Then,…………..
Yes, comrade, but deads people only need crematoria. It’s the killin ‘em that costs monay.
They’s knowed the problem since long ago.
The wisdom of….Obama will actually cut the baby in half as the compromise and then wonder why are both sides unhappy?
went “Soylent Green”.
It’s not a fraud…. it’s a unfair game stacked in favor of capital and once they win the game is over and they have all the power forever. Winning is everything.. capital won.
Austerity is overriding every issue and it is already here and will continue to be implemented. If cuts don’t come to SS and Medicare they will come from somewhere else and effect the masses not the rich and already abject poverty stricken poor. We are in for it in the short term and I can’t see where common sense and the greater good will be even given a real voice let alone be followed. If SS gets “saved” something else will get cut. Older, fixed income Americans, will suffer as will middle income (actual not BS $250k/yr) people.
Definition of Fraud:
Ludwig called it.
O no, comrade O, can’t pull this shite off with out da defrauded comprador.
Know wat I mean?
You win the internet today for that one.
These “government programs” in addition to the Bush/Obama tax cuts which primarily benefited the wealthy, included the Bush-era Medicare prescription drug program (with no controls on how much drug companies can charge), the wars, and the bank bailouts.
So the wealthy people and corporations (drug companies, war profiteers, banks) that became wealthier as a result of those “government programs”should be the ones to pay back the money.
Debt/deficit reduction spending cuts or tax increases that don’t have the effect of having the debt/deficit profiteers repay the investment made by the rest of us is theft.
Yeah, but he just given the scthupid mommy what she deserve.
Yu’ze done been checkmated. 200 moves ahead.
Let us recognize that past excess payroll taxes relative to benefit outlays (past Trust Fund surpluses under the “off budget” perspective) have been spent on other government programs. Grants of additional spending authority for Social Security must ultimately be paid out of today’s and future taxpayer resources so making them whole is not really possible
Does this guy have any issues w/ the trillions being printed up and given to the banks? So why can’t trillions be printed for any money owed to us!? Does this guy know we are NOT EMPLOYEES of the USA but we are CITIZENS!!!!!!!!!
Uh uh, comrade. It’s their investment.
The Constitution is being held in abeyance while President Obama and the MIC/MOTU do whatever it takes to protect us from underwear bombing terrorists with funny names.
Whats, yu thought these crapitalists wuz honest brokers?
Don’t get mad, comrade.
We keep discussing this issue as-if the PTB were suddenly going to decide to be convinced of our reasonable perspective and agree to pay back what they have stolen.
Meanwhile they’ve got nearly enough of us convinced that it’s the under-classes fault, to start another civil war.
The people responsible for this state of affairs have names and addresses and the whole lot of them would fit inside an average football stadium, with room left over.
And we can’t figure out what to do about it?
I’ze just the Barbarian’s SOB.
Ya didn’t befo. I’z thinkin you won’t now.
Well you could sign a petition at Move-on.org? :)
Remember, an annuity returns both principle and interest during its life and often has an insurance component, in case you live longer than you are predicted to live. I’d guess that accounts for the rate chosen, and explains why the number may seem a bit high.
Um, no’d it do’nt.
I think masaccio’s last paragraph quite accurate, oldgold, as far as it goes …
You do not, obviously. So then, how might you rewrite it to satisfy what you believe or consider to be so?
Just curious.
DW
I think masaccio’s last paragraph quite accurate, oldgold, as far as it goes …
It’s the last part of this sentence that should scare us all.
I saw that “exchange”, Ludwig.
OB said it was a good thing.
And I do consider that he meant it sincerely.
;~DW
I knowz zactly what comrade Barbarian meant, comrade Bartoo. I wearz it wit pride.
Yep.
Highly recommended.
Indeedy so!
DW
Always good to “see” you on the front page, masaccio.
Recommended … as always.
DW
Sorry, I don’t recall ever reading your recipe?
Does maintain our standard of living include being indoors and having food to eat?
Even if you grow up in poverty or even from a neglect situation, the changes proposed are severe, and hard to ‘see’ for the punitive regimes they are. In England, they are already looking at moving more children into ‘homes’ as a result of the impact of cuts. In the Daily Telegraph there was an article about how the NHS is going to short the elderly on healthcare, causing many to lose their homes due to ceilings on what the system will payout for care. Maybe it is easier to learn about what is happening in England, because their media is not afraid to express their outrage.
This article was written in a way to enrage the majority of the people against the “Rich”. He uses language that distorts reality to make it seem as if the “Rich” are “stealing” “our” money from social security, and taking Social Security off-budget was part of a “longer term project” of tax reduction for the “rich”. This is far from the truth.
The facts are:
1) Social Security’s off-budget status is to protect benefits from being reduced by the reconciliation procedures.
2)Since 1983, Social Security trust funds have accumulated large surpluses that will eventually be needed to pay promised benefits. but it’s not a true surplus, because the surplus although large is not enough to pay for future retirees.
3)Because the rest of the federal government is, in effect, borrowing from Social Security to finance part of its deficit, some accuse the rest of government of “stealing” from Social Security. In fact, Social Security trust funds invest their surplus in Treasury securities bearing the full faith and credit of the United States. The interest rate on these securities is determined by a formula that reflects market interest rates. The rest of government is no more stealing from Social Security than it is from an individual who invests some of his or her pension fund in U.S. Treasury securities.
Now let’s get into the whole tax cut for the rich craziness.
1) The government collects revenue from many different sources. For example: there are Payroll taxes (40%), income taxes (42%), corporate taxes (10%), and excise taxes(4%), other taxes and fees (4%).
2) The government spends 55% on what it calls mandatory spending (Social Security, medicare and medicaid). 39% on discretionary spending divided this way (defense 51%, domestic 46%, and international 3%).
3) Payroll taxes are set at the same level for everyone 6.2% of there income, and it’s capped at 106K, after you earn 106K you pay zero.
4) excise taxes are also the same for everyone.
5) Income taxes vary, the more you earn the higher the percentage you are taxed.
Now that we understand all that. You can see that what people mean when they same the rich are getting tax cuts, really means that the income tax RATE is being lowered, and when the Income Tax RATE is lowered at the top end people work harder so they can keep more money, but also the Government collects more dollars in tax revenue even though it was taxed at a lower rate. Lower tax rates lift tax revenue which gives the government more money to spend for everyone’s well being. This is called growing the economy and that’s the only way out of the situation, we can’t cut our way out of it, and we can’t increase tax rates to get out of it. We need to grow our way out of it, and also increase immigration with younger skilled and highly educated people.
Chef not my profession, comrade. Zat what you need?
When trying to explain this, it would help to explain that the “unified budget” deficits are the ones that are always used by the media and even by liberal economists, pundits and bloggers who should know better. For example, the surpluses at the end of the Clinton administration were really $2B and $86B instead of $125B and $236B (and other supposed surpluses were really deficits). Using the larger figures assumes that the Trust Fund obligations will not be paid out.
No one is saying that borrowing from the Trust Fund is stealing. Not paying back the money would be stealing.
As far as how great it is for the economy to lower taxes on the wealthy, well, I think we’ve all seen what’s happened to wealth, income, jobs, and opportunity in the last 30 years.
http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/income-inequality-in-america-chart-graph
http://www.businessinsider.com/what-wall-street-protesters-are-so-angry-about-2011-10?op=1
Yep and the more effective evil will pull this off because nancy and harry will back down and do what they’re told and the bat-shit-crazy people will vote for it and get their reward from the elite.
DWBartoo @ 27
I would replace it with a paragraph offering some solutions.
I have 3.
1] Tax Sub S Corps income like partnerships.
2} Disallow accelerated depreciation in computing earned income for payroll tax purposes.
3}Impose transaction tax on securities dedicated to Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid.
There are many ways to fund SS, like Raising the cap.
(Not that it needs any immediate attention)
If congress does anything other than cut social spending post-Citizens United I’ll be pleasantly surprised. Rec’d
Don’t forget the Chinese and Japanese! We owe them trillions, too, and no one is saying “We can’t afford to make them whole”.
Of course we can just print the money. Between loans, buying up of risky assets, TARP, HAMP, aark, …, some 16 programs the Federal Reserve has initiated to shovel money at the financial sector (including foreign banks) . over 16 TRILLION DOLLARS has been printed or otherwise committed.
But for some reason the 2.4 TRILLION that USA workers have sent to the govt. for their pensions is fair game.
Not the defense industry, the banking industry, the huge security state .. just those “entitlement” guys and yes if you pay it in maybe you are entitled to get it back.
Keep up the pressure on your Congresspeople. They are going to be our only defense against Obama and his slavoring minions. But they will only defend our entitlements if we scare the #$%$ out of them.
Note that under the terms of those “special” bonds in which the Trust Fund’s money has been invested, they cannot be redeemed except to cover shortfalls in SS revenue — no shortfall, no redemption, and no cost to the payers of income tax.
And that’s why the 1% (including Obama) are so interested in “strengthening” SS now.
Excellent post.
I really don’t want to get going on this But we shoulda known all this many years ago.
If we reduce SS enough maybe those bonds will never be needed. Or we can raise the tax to make sure they are never used. Or just turn them over to Wall Street. What could go wrong with that idea? Obama can help with any of those options. Give me a little time and I will find some more.
Here is another one. Just contribute those bonds to the treasury to increase the debt limit. Obama could help there too. But he may have to twist a few arms in the senate to get it done. No big deal.
Not bad, oldgold, not bad.
Thank you for your response.
Do you think any of those solutions will be enacted?
It would take Congress and the Executive.
This Congress and this Executive?
I think both are into incremental “change” … and what you suggest is simply much too radical.
Even too … reasonable … and those “changes” would upset certain people, not fictitious “people”, but certain, shall we say “well off” people?
Perhaps President Obama might use his bully pulpit to share and support what you suggest?
Perhaps he might publicly stand up and actually fight for such things?
After all, he needn’t face another election, so what’s to stop him?
The Republicans?
Or …?
Anyhow, I commend you for suggesting solutions that would not hurt the nation and might actually make some difference.
DW
Taxes for SS? On the rich? Not.ever. Going. To . Happen.
I love what’s going on here. The progressives figure raising the tax rate is the thing to do. I bet the rich agree. Just not on them. you can even raise it on the upper middle income. Just raise it enough so that it covers all and a little more than what is being paid out. Never want to dip into that fund you know.
Oh but the little extra is not to save anything. It is to pay for things like bombs. That’s what happens to any excess, as Masaccio said.
Thank you for this polite response.
We have a consumer economy, yet they want to cut “spending” on food stamps, SS, Medicare, and welfare, policies that put money back into the system; cut taxes on the rich to take money OUT of the system.
Makes too much sense; the rich can’t be gaming the system.
Good ? at this comment’s bottom W3+1B … Going ahead now has less to do with the what(s)about SS at this point — these being known at this point — as seen up top well and good in what masaccio laid out.
Now about USians will/willingness to push back/take back on/about SS politics and policy choices and SS dedicated billions and doing it.
Too bad 2012 sent such a lousy political message to the USian Looting Class and to the USian now in the WH until 2016.
Obama is doing what POTUS OBmaa wants to do /is going to do — Obama needs the Ds/GOPs doing WashingtonDC Lets Polka! politics to make optics look less about doing Looting Class politics.
POTUS Obama has been doing so all along since 2009. Too bad so many USians so willing to let Obama keep doing it in late 2012.
Stop It Now politics to do with/about SS need to be be about walk and talk politics. The Looting Class is not going to like the talking and is not going to like the walking.
USian Economic Looting Class likes doing money politics. They buy the table and then lease most/all seats at the table too. They need to be seeing this ain’t the way SS is going to get handled. Won’t like it one bit. Too bad. Too damn bad. They got it coming.
Thank you masaccio … stay with it
You seem to have a good knowlege of how SS works. Let me try to simplify your item 3 above. If I am wrong, you will tell me. When the gov receives, lets say $100, and must pay benefits of $70 (not sure if that is true any longer but bear with me.), the gov will pay 70 and give SS a bond for $30. That leaves the gov with an extra 30 to spend on bombs or whatever. From an accounting standpoint it looks like this: (journal entries are easier than t accounts for this)
Receive cash 100
Pay Retirees 70
Issue bond to SS 30
The the gov spends the remaining 30:
Purchase bomb 30
Cash bal 30
So SS has financed the fed but has gotten a bond for its trouble. It also means that the rich did not have to pay any more taxes for the bomb which they would have had to do. So in this sense, the rich have been getting a break while we are buying some of the bombs. Things are turning around now so there is not as much surplus. Therefore, the rich want to “reform” SS so they don’t have to pay more for the bomb. Nice work if you can get it. So far they have been pretty good at it.So they would be just “proud” to raise the rate on payroll (since they don’t pay hardly any of it.)Or any of the other things I noted above.
Anyhow that’s my take. I would like to know where this is wrong.
Lets just say a little something on taxation. Payroll tax is a very regressive tax. It affects those with the least money the most.
People at the top have been doing an awful lot of “keeping” their money you know. This differential in incomes have been growing exponetially these past 35 years or so. Nearly all increases in productivity has gone to the top one percent. The median inflation adjusted wage rates for working people has barely moved since the 70s. And now we see the rich are a threat to democracy through lobbying and buying elections. It must be fixed. Only way I know to do it is increase their taxes. Obama blew it but better than nothing. What we need to do is increase tax rates at the top dramatically, not bc the gov needs their money to fix the deficit (they don’t) but bc they need to pay their fair share.
Yes. I believe all 3 are politically doable.
From 1914 until 1965 the US had a securities transaction tax (STT). So it is not unprecedented. In fact, currently the US has a minuscule SST (.0034 %) that funds the SEC
Here is the most recent proposal liberals have advanced in Congress.
Much, much room left over. I know what to do:
1 raise income tax rates very high on high incomes of the 1%.
2 Raise estate tax rates very high on the top 10%.
If you can get it, go for it.
…he told the unvarnished truth and you went into O-bot apoplexy.
Paper published by the conservative Hudson Institute 2009, “The 1983 Social Security Reforms: Real and Misremembered Lessons for Today’s Leaders” explains Greedspan’s regressive taxation coverup. Were were the pwoggies?
The left is hapless. They simply do not understand what is going on. They all have their “formula” right from the gut,and it feels good. Too bad it doesn’t work that way. But it is not only here. Europe has an even bigger case of austerity to help the rich. It’s a disease and we caught it.
FDR designed Social Security as an insurance to protect all workers from the otherwise merciless nature of a free market system. What is often omitted in current discussions of the program is that it protects children and survivors when a worker dies young. Paul Ryan, for example, received such a benefit when his father died while he was still a minor. The program also provides income when a worker is disabled, whether from illness or injury, and can no longer work. These benefits are acquired with a minimum of twenty quarters of paying into the system. This aspect, too, is almost never mentioned in current debates.
As to the better known old age pension part of the plan, this protects all eligible people. Even if a person is prosperous at one point in life, and invests enough to provide an old age income, that person may easily in our free market system lost all his/her money and end up indigent at age 65.
In his wisdom, FDR designed the plan so that all contributed and all were equally insured – even the most wealthy. This was to assure buy-in from all classes, making it clear that anyone might at some point need this form of insurance.
The system works and does much to assure the social peace desired by all classes. Even the wealthiest benefit when the poor are not so desperate that they arrive at their mansions with pitchforks and torches. The Pete Petersons who want to create a world of starvation and despair would do well to remember how much FDR did to keep the present class structure from dissolving in civil disorder.
Apoplexy? My gosh, you are a sensitive barbarian.
Any surplus of SS over payouts to retirees is used for world wide adventures. When that excess surplus disappears – like now – it becomes necessary to cut SS (reform it to make it sustainable are the words)- or raise the payroll tax or both to restore the surplus. That way the rich don’t have to pay more taxes. Wars r us. Carry on.
Raygun & Greedspan’s scam saved the “wealth creators” beaucoup taxes during “Breakfast on America” – you know, when the Amerkan economy had to be recovered from the toilet by Laugher economics. Thing is, this was just a crapitalist scam, a long shot. But WTF, proles can’t do any better so TINA.
And if the shit hit the fan latter, well the rich would just find a way to cut the proles loose. So they defrauded proles in the ’80′s and then, when things did go to crap, which they expected (what else w/ a fraud bubble economy and Wall Street “creative destruction”), they defraud the proles again to keep the crapitalist winnings alive.
Hope y’all enjoyed your fucking beamers and such.
This is how class warfare goes. Surprised? And ya know, it ain’t just normal capitalist warfare, so y’all can take some comfort in that. But that you missed how abnormal it is, how ruthless and desperate they are to save the crapitalist hierarchy, and the root causes, that takes some doing, comrades.
While you were having Breakfast on America, the crapitalist’s were executing their revolution.
One more time, the surplus did not *disappear*, it’s held in the Trust Fund in the form of bonds. You don’t have to raise payroll taxes to “fund” the Trust fund. It’s already funded. You only need the government to HONOR it’s responsibility and have them pay when they come due rather than come up with 15 million excuses to raise the age so you can put off paying those bonds and the interest they’ve accrued.
HONOR? Say, have I told you, Crapitalism is Fraud?
You havnt been following. Not enough time to go through it all again.
What Ludwig said. I know you may think him nuts but he is not.
Story is out that Jack Lew will be next Treasury Sec. What do we know about him other than budget director.
BTW never said the fund disappeared.
C’mon comrade, a consumer economy? That horse-shit was part of the chronic crapitalist scam.
How you gonna hold them to their fraudulent promises? They laffin atcha, comrade.
Who is paying your check? The Koch brothers or Peterson?
You left out the part that they threw everyone but the top 0.1 percent under the bus the last 30 years and then ran them over again with the Bush tax cuts.
You can whine about how much harder every one worked the last 10 years, but really unless you are self employed with some kind of business scam to shelter your earnings, the working folk hit marginal tax rates north of 50 percent, not including missing out on special tax programs that lower earners get.
The current state of the economy and the widening income and wealth gap under the Bush tax cuts for the rich show the Bush tax cut incentive was not progressely increasing the economy and job force, it was destroying the US upper, middle and lower classes.
The Bush tax cuts combined with the financial industry’s capture of government have turned what used to be 4 percent of corporate profit to a 40 percent of corporate profit while at the same time converting their worthless investments into publicly guaranteed ones.
I follow just fine.
There isn’t a stack of IOUs. There isn’t an empty vault. There are a bunch of bonds. Bonds that accrue interest. The Trust Fund is just fine. The problem isn’t the fund but the politicians who want to play games with a program that keeps people from poverty so they can avoid having to figure out ways to pay the bonds ad infinitum. If they can just keep the fund REQUIRED to reinvest in more bonds it means they don’t have to cut spend, increase taxes, or borrow from other investors to pay for the elderly.
Most economies can be exploited as long as human nature plays a part in the exchange of goods or services.
It doesn’t help though that many are not intelligent enough to figure out that all an economy is, is redistribution. All the arguing is over who you trust to do the redistributing. If whoever is in charge of the redistribution is corrupt you are going to have problems.
Hate to say this but I’m not sure if we had a socialist government with THIS PARTICULAR BATCH OF POLITICIANS we wouldn’t be looking at the same problems since it’s fairly obvious that our representation is anxious to make everything a giveaway to corporate America at the expense of citizens.
Ya gotta admit, those kwapitalists found themselves a bounty of compradors and turned them into some nasty Phillistines and bamboozled wage slaves. That McCarthy was a good investment.
And now even Occupy scares the pants offum.
They’s beyond lesser evil.
We’ve had this conversation befo, comrade waltz. You’ze in the thick of this insanity and you still talkin bout the ubiquity of corruption and the fallen nature of mankind. I knowze where you’s comin from.
Before I gets to dat, doe, I gots to point out that your private definition of “economy”, well, it’s mierda del toro (and that ain’t Benicio’s niece. You’ze got this authoritarian hangup tis associated wit yo profession. You see ain’t but few people gots a choice in whose gonna do their redistributin. For dat and udder reasons, yo analysis is kwap.
Buttin that’s not the worst of yo time-wastin. It’n almost sounds like you want to overthrow da guberment to fix this problem. Well, see, we here on Planet Home are wonderin wat de fuck you’ze doin here on a progressive website. Cause you’ze about thirty years behind the times comrade.
I’m guessin dat yo just gettin to acceptin that librul affliction that de guberment iz sposed to regulate de corporatist assholes. You know, gib em sum dicipline. O, but you’ze way, way too late, comrade.
If you only understood how shitty dis hole system is by tommorrow, I’d speck you be ded of an aneurysm.
So, pardon me, but your analysis is FUBAR.
Capitalism is fraud, comrade.
According to both the Parliamentary Budget Office and the Auditor General of Canada, Canada Pension Plan (the analogue of US Social Security) will be solvent for a minimum of 75 years. Canada Pension Plan is available at age 60.
Over and above Canada Pension Plan, Canadians receive a minimum of $500 a month Old Age Security Pension regardless of their income, and over and above THAT, up to an additional $700 a month (means tested – i.e under $39,000 annual income) Guaranteed Income Supplement.
A Canadian with no company pension would get Canada Pension, Old Age Security, and Guaranteed Income Supplement amounting to $2300 a month for each individual, in other words, about $4600 a month for a couple.
I know they’re scamming, I left out the wink ;)
But, to consume (like Bush asked) and service each other is about all there’s left of the REAL economy. I also know there’s room for radical change– However, I don’t see us getting there from here, comrade. We’d have to be completely re-educated for that. Currently, we’re like the Jim Jones followers in Giana– Baffled by bullshit. I’m just here to drop a thought bomb, or brain fart, depending on how one sees it.
Ideological tenets don’t pay the rent!
BINGO it’s all for thre wealthy to control otrhers at a certain point.
Ah. Thanks for your good humor. These lies cascade, they deflect or disrupt the conversation, and they proliferate to frustrate the verdict on the sinister. They trumpeted “consumer economy” when it threatened to become obvious that private debt and “financial assets” were largely what crapitalists were producing.
Desperation thought bombing, hmmm. Well they say misery loves company, comrade.
Well, that’s the thing about pragmatism and rationality. They are usually methods to deny potential, code words to prune dreams. Now, on one hand, I remember when I was a boy, there was a classroom poster which said, “A man’s reach must exceed his grasp” I think they had excised “or what’s a heaven” for by that time. It was Apollo era and “we” were reaching into the heavens so maybe the poster was some NASA propaganda. Still, I’m with Browning.
But principally, when you know that this system is an utter fraud AND genocidal, well, it’s either beat ‘em or go insane with ‘em.
And the wrong ones will make you broke.
You can call my definition whatever you like. Whether it be beads, shells or moolah, goods or services all an economy does is redistribute things
As for my chosen profession, I’m a parent. So yes there is an element of authoritarian in there. Prior to that I was a corpsman and again very thin element of authoritarian but I think you’d have a hard stretch finding ANY field that does not require order and rules(or as you laughingly refer to it as AUTHORITARIANISM).
Perhaps you believe that if we were to abolish capitalism we’d have some type of utopia but you don’t particularly offer any compelling argument that convinces me that your version of economy would deal with the human component of economics that says that each individual has an unlimited amount of wants with only a limited means to fill them. That would occur whether you have capitalism, socialism or any other form of economy. As a matter of fact the sneering you do at the idea that the government has an underlying responsibility to ensure that people aren’t taken advantage of tells me that your version of utopia largely resembles Somalia.
Listen to yourself, comrade: “the human component of economics” says ” that each individual has an unlimited amount of wants with only a limited means to fill them.”
That’s the human component?
Here’s the main problem, comrade. All rules are not created equal. Some systems of rule are evil. You have to know how to combat that problem. Replacing one set of worn out gamesmen by another is not effective (unless you really don’t care what happens to your kids).
You don’t understand this system.
Excellent article. If we want change of any significance, we are going to have to stop sending to Washington DC multimillionaire members of the Wall Street investor class who care more about their personal stock portfolios than they care about the majority of us. Yes, it really is this simple. Until we stop sending these people to Washington DC NOTHING of any significance will change for the majority of us. It is a class war. We continue to send the 1% to represent the 99% and wonder why nothing changes. Insane! absolutely insane!
This morning I read in Der Spiegel that the Germans plan to raise their workers salaries by 6% this year. I asked myself as I wish many more Americans would: Why is Germany who has a $3.57 trillion GDP is talking about raising the wages of their workers over 6% when the USA who has a $15.07 trillion GDP has a business and political leadership who continue to propose austerity measures, fire its workers, pay them substandard wages (for productive work that has increased the stock portfolios of the rich by millions of dollars over the past five years) and on top of it all have the mean spiritedness to belittle American workers as “lazy.”
BUT MOST OF ALL: WHY DO WE KEEP SENDING THESE AHOLES WHO DON’T REPRESENT US BACK TO WASHINGTON? IT IS NOTHING SHORT OF INSANITY.
Because our “economy” is an even more pernicious fraud.
Because our system is a fraud. They drove us insane.
Now was that so hard?
Finally, you show a little of the chef that’s been avoiding my questions.
Please, learn to be more discriminating in the future, comrade.
Sorry, did I misunderstand?
Are you saying that you are not, and do not intend to work towards “beating them”?
Comrade, I am not their double agent. You do misunderstand.
Beat ‘em
is not a recipe. I, last, am only advising that continue to look more deeply behind their veil and not expect easy answers from comrade Ludwig.