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Let’s see:
The MyFDL mod, who has been recently doing things like regularly promoting diaries by such decidedly non-Obama-fans as black-bloc advocates, third-party advocates, and other folk of similar kidney, is suddenly being denounced as an evil fascist censoring Obamabot out to get all of the relatively recent arrivals to MyFDL over the past year because he or she saw what is now a very rare sight in MyFDL — a comments thread that grew to well over 100 comments — and, not likely having seen such a thing before, apparently just panicked at its unusual size and zapped it.
Might be time for everyone here to take a few nice, deep, calming breaths. Maybe this might help:
I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.
There! Don’t know about you, but I feel better already.
114 Comments
LOL! Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam’s litany; I keep it on a Blogging Help word.doc. Yes; I feel better already.
Yup. And anger is fear’s twin, as is cynicism.
Hasn’t seen such a thing before?
Umm… that’s a pretty serious educational deficiency.
Sorry, PW, but that appears to be one of the dumbest things I’ve ever seen. (And while I sometimes disagree with you, I can’t recall you posting anything, you know, dumb.)
Something wrong with anger? Yeah — we haven’t got enough of it. Isn’t it a common complaint that Americans are too passive — not angry enough — to get out in the street like the Arab Spring? Isn’t it a complaint that we are too meek, too willing to take it from the oligarchs?
And cynicism? I defer to Ambrose Bierce’s wonderful Devils Dictionary: “A cynic is a blackguard who insists on seeing things as they are, not as they should be or as others would like them to be.”
What we need is universal cynicism and universal anger against the elites and the system of government that they have corrupted.
Phoenix Woman–
I agree with 2/3′s of your expressed sentiment, but heh, that’s a starter! :-)
Reference BP: “And cynicism? I defer to Ambrose Bierce’s wonderful Devils Dictionary: “A cynic is a blackguard who insists on seeing things as they are, not as they should be or as others would like them to be.”
Couldn’t have said it better.
But thanks for a post to “break the ice,” PW.
Thanks–
Blue
Anger can often mask fear, but I don’t see them as twins. Anger can simply be a reaction to perceived injustice or threats to oneself, or thank goodness, others, as in: our spiritual brothers and sisters. Anger turned sideways can spike humor, turned inward, can cause depression.
I think it’s seriously underrated as useful for effecting change for the better, righting wrongs, etc. Cynicism? Looks like others have found a comforting definition, but I’d guess that some smidgeon of the appreciation of irony might be in the mix.
Those who ask: “How can you not be at least a bit cynical if you’re paying attention?” sorta have my vote.
Twenty years ago, a friend called me a ‘pleasant cynic’, but I never could decipher what she meant exactly. Might be true, but to me it would imply ‘anticipating (humans, perhaps) will always do their worst, and I don’t believe that. Politicians, hedge funders, banksters? Yeah, probably. ;o)
Need to let ‘cynicism’ roll around in my head for a bit…
Zounds, EK! Long time since we’ve seen you; how nice.
Boy, I hope OFG see’s this comment of yours. Did you make that nonsense up or are you quoting someone else?
That’s not fear, it’s disgust at prissy mods censoring critical comments about bad people such as TBogg and Van Jones. In at least one of those cases, financial considerations apply.
Yup. Anger is sometimes just Fear’s beard. But if it is married to a good cause, it can blossom into righteous indignation and give birth to justice and vindication and integrity. I’m sure we dan develop this emotional family tree further… :-)
Thank you. Drop by any time-
The Stars Hollow Gazette
DocuDharma
Ah, I posted at DocuDharma for a time; just couldn’t handle the html-required software, and the colors…made my brain even more Abby-normal than usual; had to stop. But great diaries, great authors! (yerself included, of course)
Could
n’thave said it better me-ownself, LOL! (But: how to we fashion the tree, Pug?)The answer is to just let people say what they will, unless it gets into insane and inarguably offensive areas such as straight-up racism, etc
OY!!
:-)
Just like Hufrfington Post, eh? Maybe we should put a few of the commentators who spend all of their waking hours on this website in charge of moderation, then they can control every conversation to suit them and their agenda, just like happens over there. No thanks. There is a reason I lit on FDL and stayed and it’s because it’s not Huffington Post or Americablog.
I, for one, am sick at the “be oh-so-nice and lift-your-pinky” prisses tsk-tsking at people who are genuinely angry and NOT afraid to speak truth to power. Whenever I read some self-appointed know-it-all tell me how I can or cannot act or what I can or cannot say, I want to smack that know-it-all.
Angry doesn’t come close to how I feel these days, and when people are told to be deferential to a blatantly phony, turncoat asshole who does not deserve a modicum of respect, it angers me. Why on earth would anyone want that phony bastard Van Jones to go away thinking Rahm was right about us being a bunch of f’n r*t*rds?
You do realize that The Mgt has now weighed in, and that your opinion is now inoperative?
As one who wants word to mean what the actually mean, not how someone defines them for their own purposes, I submit this to you re cynicism:
“beliefs that people are generally selfish and dishonest”
Then why are you here if you so loath the blog and deplore it’s community so? I can’t help but think that there is a whooooooole lot of unplumbed internet “real estate” out there and there’s bound to be, almost certain to be, a blog that suits you right down to your toes. This isn’t meant as snark. I’m genuinely confused as to why the person who just typed out that kind of visceral hatred of this place would continue to hang around. Unless you’re here because they get abundant traffic, which brings me to the next obvious question: Don’t you think that maybe there is abundant traffic here because of the model and not in spite of it? I feel the same way you do about Van Jones but I wanted him to carry a sincere message back to the Democratic establishment that they can’t count on progressive support this year. All he would have gotten if I’d bad-mouthed him and cursed his allies would have been confirmation of what Rahm believes, not refutation.
Understand your point and hope that your effort pays off. I didn’t participate in the Jones book salon and today went through the comments. And though you didn’t ask for MHO -and probably could care less about it, it still is something I’ll express- here it is.
Jones didn’t appear to be prepared for the format,e.g. the comment about carpal syndrome and the repeated exhortations to buy or borrow his book.
MOST book salons appear to be about books the FDL readership have NOT read and many authors seem to realize that and seek to explain their efforts in a way to get those participating in the salons to ‘buy or borrow’ the book. Jones simply didn’t.
Jones also appeared to ignore questions related to his ideas expressed in the book but were not in keeping with his optimism; poor style.
Some commentators made comments that were,well, confrontational and, apparently, bordering on being an affront to Jones. Those commentators don’t seem to realize that confrontation in this medium is open to bringing about a ‘failure to communicate’.
But some comments critiquing a commenter’s comments such as ‘I’m outa here’ also seemed defensive for no reason at all.
There, I’m done. Oh, and a movie I think you’ll enjoy is “The Oxford Murders”; Ludwig Wittgenstein is core to the movie.
Do you think it’s fine & dandy to call someone a racist who’s evidently an anti-racist, the way you keep doing when you post here that Elizabeth Stanton was a racist?
Will you retract?
If fear and anger aren’t exactly twins, they’re often entwined, like loathing and disgust, which I think is what we see here of late. Calling loathing and disgust ‘fear’ and ‘anger’ don’t make them fear and anger (Abe Lincoln’s lack of s-v agreement there, not mine).
AitchD !
If you get a retraction or apology, I’ll buy you a Pint of our best Local Brew … *g*
Did anyone ask Mr. Jones if he wrote the book all by himself?
Petro!
As I’ve told you, I had my first Guinness at Toronto’s Man of Aran tavern, and I recall you’re not a Fan of Stout. (I miss your town terribly!)
We have a local Irish Pub that makes its own Brew[not Stout] … very, very good !
Oh, I thoroughly agree!~ Van Jones came to Firedoglake prepared for the Daily Kos and it’s great to get him out of his comfort zone! I don’t think it’s necessary to call him names to do so though. While immensely gratifying, I can’t see how it would be useful to say something like,
That would have felt great for a few seconds, (until my comment disappeared anyway), but he would have just gotten pissed and dismissed all of the very legitimate criticism in that comment, then he would have gone back to whatever Democratic circus he hangs out at and talked about how we can’t have a rational conversation.
Ouch!
Well played, sir.
I don’t fault Van Jones for hanging in with the Dems and continuing his cause … the Tea Party are a scary bunch, from my vantage point up here.
{{{ Peg }}}
In one month it will be ten years since I visited Toronto.
You’ll be pleasantly surprised when you visit us again … we’ve grown but still maintain our civility and multi-cultural pride.
Our Local breweries are doing really well, too …
However each of us feels about Van Jones, my point is that I know for a fact that he would never have taken any useful information back to the Democrats if I’d badmouthed him. I don’t know that he carried the intended message back anyway of course but I know he wouldn’t have it I had been an asshole toward him. How do I know? Because I would have reacted that way. I’m not going to lend any credibility to somebody going on the attack while trying to persuade me to their point of view and I don’t expect anyone else to either.
I read the thread later, good on all those who tried to keep the conversation civil. We can engage with intelligence and facts, for greater effect.
Not that I remember reading.
Yeah, I kinda cringe at the thought that a mod, a newbie one, or anyone, would zap a diary cuz comments hit the century mark.
I mean, read thru them, maybe? Take it higher up the admin chart? Zapping a diary for that alone, bad form IMHO, rookie or not.
Common sense would dictate, I’m new at my job, hmmm this is different, maybe I should run it by someone above me and learn something.
PW, thanks, you and SC have at least spoken about what went on.
You know what sides I’ve taken in the past wrt to diaries, what I think is inappropriate given FDL guidelines, etc.
And you know I strongly supported FDL when others sought to usurp its pages for what EVER cockeyed reasons till they learnt who owned the place and what the rules are. ;-)
I fully support FDL ownership and admin . . . but this one, it’s out of the wild . . . FDL is better than this, and so should be their mods.
I understand there’s been a lot of turnover at FDL and MyFDL past two years, and that’s sad, some really good people are no longer behind the scenes, some others not so good at all are also gone.
But the chaos seems to grow, incrementally, due to that past turnover.
Wishing Mz. Hamsher, you and the others the best.
I guess, like it or not change is always inevitable.
LeSigh.
Petro –
I beg to differ on one point: we can ask questions using intelligence and facts, but that doesn’t mean that people like Van Jones will actually engage on that basis. I asked several intelligent questions supported by facts, and was ignored until finally he gave a full-platitude non-response reply.
When a guy starts out by arguing for using primaries to get “better” Dems in office, he’s fair game for a question about why didn’t he organize primary challenges to Obama, Pelosi, etc., no?
When he claims that Nancy Pelosi was the best Dem Speaker of the House ever, he’s fair game for being asked to defend that statement in light of the fact that Pelousy took impeachment off the table, caved on the Public Option, and is pushing for enactment of Simpson-Bowles, yes?
I was always under the impression that fear and loathing are the twins.
-HST
*G*
“Take it higher up the admin chart?” ; the mod did; it was just that Scarecrow didn’t respond quick enough and there was panic. Do you have your towel?
LOL!
Awesome.
It’s hard to believe that — no, it’s impossible to imagine that some dedicated (as it were) Dem staffer(s) hadn’t followed the Salon here. And followed up reading here after. What happened next, you’d have to be fly on the wall to know.
Err lies the rub Margaret, we CAN’T have a rational conversation. The 1% and their minions like Van Jones are fully corrupted, and WON’T listen to us, much less DO anything to change the status quo which benefits them to the utmost by despoiling the masses in every way.
You can’t have a rational conversation with the overseers, the balance of power is just too fully tilted one way.
You CAN scare the overseers, tho . . . or at least we could (Kennedy, LBJ, even Nixon were influenced by the maddening nd growing hordes of DFH’s in their times).
Sadly, I don’t think we can influence the overseers at all, anymore.
Not from within the systems, not from without.
From within is impossible, it’s all too fully corrupted.
From without, the means of repression are incredibly severe, MUCH more so than in the 60′s.
That leaves, the collapse of the empire of its own volition, revolution with incredibly bloody outcomes, financial collapse and a splintering of states like USSR, or mama nature does us in, fast or slow take yer pick.
Always good to see yer fonts, I took a bit of a vacation from the place lately . . . not sure I’ll be around as much, but the past two days have had some things that caught my eye.
Still lurk and read Dayen/Walker, et al, best news site for social media ever . . . along with the usual suspects of the proggy vein, domestic and international.
*G*
Best to you and pooch . . . or is it gato, I forget! lol
Ah, I was just tryin’ to play with the idea that we were in agreement, but you said it better…and shorter, which I
couldn’tdidn’t do. The strikeout didn’t quite negate what I’d hope to…negate.The rest of the stuff about the emotional reasons that led to pulling my post…I dunno if any of this tracks. But the thread has already gone off in other directions anyway. But it does need to get sorted out; people are pretty restless over the wider implications of censoring comments.
Right, those are the great doctor’s twins. I was using Germaine Greer’s twins, a chapter title from TFE. *g*
Really, that’s the story you take from SC’s comments?
Ok.
But the mod zapped it, FIRST, before taking it to admin.
N that would be MY point, hoss . . . in case ya MISSED that.
*G*
Nice try tho . . . LMAO!
Hope all is well with you and NYC . . .
Yep.
*G*
Or perhaps you would have made some money on a real-estate deal; those guys can be pretty dense. ;-)
Jones was apparently notified that he was to attend the forum earlier that day. He’d been to 4 cities since Tuesday and Saturday was supposed to be his off day. His publicist screwed up by not telling him sooner.
As I’ve said before the book itself doesn’t lend itself to a Book Salon type format. A simple question about “The Grid” would take pages to answer, hence the carpal tunnel response. I struggled for a week to come up with some questions that could be answered with short responses and came away unable to do that. And I actually read the book, twice. I’m certainly not a Jones fan, and told the editors that prior to taking on the task, but I did learn some things about organizing from the book.
And before y’all start all the rebuttals understand they’re not excuses, they’re facts, and I have no intention of getting into a pissin’ contest over them, so save your time and energy. Flames cheerfully ignored.
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I’m trying to imagine something like, oh, say, Caturday (speaking as a bona fide cat lady my ownself) or maybe one of the Ha Ha, Look Over Here, Isn’t Mittens A Big Old Stupid Rich Guy diaries getting zapped first and analyzed later once the comments reached the unheard of level of 100 (OMFG!!!!!). And I am just not buying it, sorry. I appreciate that Scarecrow acknowledged the error and put the diary back up but I’d feel better if somebody owned up to the fact that the content of the diary had something to do with it getting zapped. I think we’ve seen many people post various sorts of insults – to people who are actually on the thread - Even if their comments get moderated, the diary doesn’t get zapped.
Well, I’m not prepared to believe that all of the other times in US history when the radicals have asserted themselves were less important or less severe than the situation is now. We’ve had robber barons slaughtering people who stood in their way, we’ve had manufacturing empires poison whole regions, we’ve had exploitation, sweat shops and slave labor, we’ve even fought what was one of the bloodiest civil wars in recorded history but we’re still a country, actual and whole. I’m not ready to give up and wait for entropy to assert itself yet.
The premise of this post, that someone panicked, is entirely false. PW does not know what she is talking about. Whatever the intentions of this post, it was poor judgment and a disservice to FDL.
No mod made a mistake. I did. Period. End of story. The next person who attacks any of our Volunteers for the thankless work they do needs to thnk of me as Jabba the Hut, and you are standing over the trap door. enough, people.
Who in the world is silly enough to flame a dragon?
*G*
History is what it is, indeed, bloody and violent.
However, repression it seems to me, has reached a new zenith capable of choking out all dissent.
N they ain’t done with power and control yet, by any means, the internet is a thorn in their side that must be removed.
As to entropy, nah, we is just livin out our time on this rock as best and good as we can, that’s not entropy.
I’m not entropic just cuz I’m not rioting . . . *G* Neither are you.
Inevitability, now, that’s a dif creature . . . empires who fail to care for the masses fail, that’s inevitable per history.
*G*
Only one little detail left.
Was it zapped before you were sent notification (regardless of when you acted n thanks for DOING so)?
Cuz I’d like to suggest, if it was, that all y’all reconsider mod guidelines in this particular aspect . . . for newbies, bless their hearts and all staff, paid or volunteer . . .
I’m not complainin, anymore . . . as as I’ve said, my record speaks for itself in support of the site.
I’m sorry you said that about PW in that manner, tho, she’s always been kewl for the most part . . . internal matters, perhaps best left of the pages in THIS regard, wheras zapped diaries are a public issue (it would seem).
Again, thanks for all you do.
And, of course, never write, as Atonement‘s Briony Tallis asks Lola: “What’s the worst word you can possibly imagine?”
And in her defense, PW was REALLY well versed in the mod(s) efforts to further proggy ideals in all the ways she describes, very supportive . . . of the mod(s).
Or it reads like that to me anyways.
I guess, most of you folks (admin) aren’t really speaking to me, as I didn’t really go batshit over the issue as others did . . . *G*
So I ‘spose about now I should shut my pie hole around some blueberry cobbler.
*G*
Of course we’re entropic, from the day we are born. But I was referring to socio political entropy of course. They PTB always get new toys and new tools to suppress dissent. Sometimes they win for a day, a year or a decade and then they lose. The only thing that is “inevitable” is change. We KNOW things are going to change. What is unclear is how they will change or when they will change but change they will. I’m not ready to give up trying to shape that change and I’m a little confused as to why someone so resigned to failure and chaos would waste his time arguing about it.
I grew up in a pretty tough neighborhood, so it’s same old to me. But it might be part of the training to take a look at a few examples of past unpleasantness and discuss what courses of action were appropriate and effective.
You don’t just throw n00bs to the sharks.
Also, moderation is NOT a popularity contest. If you want to be loved by everybody write pootie diaries.
Thank you Scarecrow. I wanted to say this earlier and held off hoping you would chime in:
What a condescending diary, employing PW’s typical tactic of linking to something to “prove her point,” which in fact does not support it at all.
Not piling on here, PW, but seriously: You do this all the time.
Dearest Mods,
Maybe you could collect a batch of ‘Flag this comment as inappropriate’ clicks from the history (no names, please!), send them up/down to Jon Walker, who might analyze the distribution and offer an opinion on the ‘flag’s’ effectiveness.
And maybe explain to therestofus what the flag’s purpose is, that is, if it’s different from voting for a POTUS.
Riiiight.
Anger is what we use when we want to pretend to others that we’re not afraid.
Cynicism is what we use when we want a reason to avoid the hard, constant disappointment-filled long-view work that real change requires.
Sorry if I misinterpreted the statement of yours to which I linked. But I think you misinterpreted my diary.
I wasn’t attacking anyone or anything aside from the notion, which judging from the comments that were still being posted in that very long thread, that the disappearance of Wendy’s diary was a deliberate act of censorship, and a sign that whoever did it was trying to turn FDL into another pro-Obama rah-rah site. In view of the diaries being promoted lately, such censorship for such reasons would be unlikely in the extreme.
Appreciate the info re “His publicist screwed up by not telling him sooner.”
Somewhere I missed “As I’ve said before the book itself doesn’t lend itself to a Book Salon type format.” Was that in the intro to the salon? If not, then such might have been helpful.
But if a book “doesn’t lend itself to a Book Salon type format”, why bring it? Excuse me but logic has been a downfall of mine all my life.
And #45; see, you aren’t sure whether it was withdrawn before SC was called in; that was what I took from SC’s comments in the Salon. That it was withdrawn.
Anyway, I’m not in NYC though I lived there from 65 to 67 and on the island from 68 to 69.
I have no idea how books are chosen for the Book Salon.
As for the Intro, I’m not perfect.
Got that, folks? Scarecrow is the boss of you.
I know. Rather opportunistic, isn’t he?
Meanwhile, Wendy, who like myself I’m guessing grew up reading the Dune books, understood perfectly what I meant with this diary. And she’s the person who actually would have the most justification for anger/fear/etc. (And yes, anger is fear’s twin.)
I made a comment about the book’s not lending itself to the forum late in the BS thread, after the guest had left, and again at yesterday’s Lakeside Diner.
Thank you for the little litany about not giving in to fear. I will try to keep that in mind next time I speak with a LOTE voter who tells me how afraid I should be of the Tea Party.
After 20 years of doing crisis and other counseling I agree with your anger assessment.
Actually this was meant for #70 but what the hey. Thanks; stopped reading -today- after Jones had left and don’t frequent the Lakeside Diner so I missed your efforts.
As for #67, “I have no idea how books are chosen for the Book Salon.
As for the Intro, I’m not perfect.” ; wow; and here I was under the impression that the person bringing the ‘guest’ to the Salon was the one who chose the book. More FDL mystery.
I’m only perfect at being imperfect; part of Wittgenstein’s argument.
I don’t think it would have looked very good if I’d said in the Intro that I thought the book wasn’t a very good choice for the forum then laid out my reasoning.
If you go to the Book Salon link at the top of the page you’ll see a long list of upcoming events. I would imagine that the hosts for most of those salons have yet to chosen.
Not resigned to failure and change for the better.
Waiting.
Grasshopper.
Now, I’m not sure why you take the tact that I AM resigned, beyond what I write . . . I often offer hope, alternatives, I just don’t think I have the magic gift of KNOWING what will happen.
History, tho, tells us what is likely.
We don’t really disagree about a lot.
We both need jobs (I think mine is coming soon thank dawg), and we both are neglected in these times for many reasons, as are the masses.
Hmm, your comment is deep and full.
Ok, change, we agree, it’s inevitable. Good.
TO wit, and to end, the only dif seems to be regarding our place or our actions in the fight at hand.
Shaping, interesting . . . yes, I shape daily, in all my efforts and interactions with others (job aside when I get it, I don’t discuss politics, religion or personal life at work).
I don’t get actively involved, I’ll admit. I did try to hit some Sac Occupy at times, but, that’s nowhere’s for reasons I’ve described elsewhere.
My activism, is confined these days to my apartment neighbors, related to our garden grows, and asking them to do some themselves.
That don’t displace the fact, that if it’s necessary, and I and mine are under seige, I won’t go full Wolverine at a monents notice.
Hope that ‘splains more about me than ya knew, ma’am.
Oh, hey, don’t take anything I wrote as a dig Larue. Just ‘splainin’ my point of view is all. :)
Oh yeah! And I hope that job comes soon for you!
Oh, dear; it looks as though I need to explain a couple things.
Due to some old brain issues, when I have headaches, I read poorly, and tend to see…only portions of things, which is part of the reason I am crap at commenting, and better at writing diaries (at least I hope so,lol).
When I read your post, I zeroed in on the Reverend Mother’s litany, not only because it was a familiar thing to anchor to, but also because I have found it, and other meditations, useful over my life, which has been full of fear-producing situations I needed to put in abeyance while I lived through them. Still do, in fact, but that’s not important just nowis suddenly being denounced as an evil fascist censoring Obamabot out to get all of the relatively recent arrivals to MyFDL over the past year because he or she saw what is now a very rare sight in MyFDL .
So I will say that it may have been because of this, I really missed a lot of the core essence of your diary, and I regret that I only addressed that part.
When I came back and read again, I was surprised that I’d missed all this:
(the mod) “…is suddenly being denounced as an evil fascist censoring Obamabot out to get all of the relatively recent arrivals to MyFDL over the past year because he or she saw what is now a very rare sight in MyFDL, etc.”
When my diary was reinstated, the comments were really hard for me to track, as were the many on jaango’s post. But what I read wasn’t at all about the characterization you gave, but about moderation issues in general, and specific objections in particular. I confess that being on of the ‘relatively recent arrivals (a year and a half or two for me; am I still a recent arrival? Not in my book), I take it a bit personally, PW. I may have more than 150, 170 diaries here, and it’s up to readers to rec them, comment, judge their worth or not.
The reader’s diaries had always seemed a wholly different space than the front page to me, but I’d kinda liked that some of the folks over yonder had started coming over to read my posts, and while I can’t be sure, it seemed like many of the comments were from folks who mainly read and comment on the Mother Ship. Some of that is no doubt down to the fact that some of them were feeling a lot of the frustration that I noted in the Salon thread, so my post may have acted as a bit of a Public Service Vent-a-thon for them, as well as myself.
As far as comment numbers at My.fdl, I agree with you. But not all that long ago, not a few of mine would have in the neighborhood of 150-200, and when I scroll down the threads, I am saddened to see how many great folks have departed, some having been banned, others who left after kerfuffles with mods, some: who knows?
As a current case in point, OFG just told me that he found another comment of his on his dashboard that had been moderated out, and so he reckoned that FDL would be more glad than sad at his departure, regardless of the messages we had given him that it was not so. But it served to show me that management, maybe even with the help of denizens, need to solve what seems to be an intermittent, if not recurring problem. That the site evolves over time would seem natural, and changes don’t come pain-free for some. But I think everyone here would agree that it’s worth working out the bugs.
p.s. I was just in contact with OFG for the first time. I’d asked him if I might mention his choice, but I hadn’t heard back before I posted this. I messed up, as he just sent a message tha he emphatically didn’t want me to mention it here, because he doesn’t want FDL to interpret his choice as being angry at the site. He loves the place and all the people. So I apologize for jumping the gun, but figured it was okay since he’d posted his decision on my thread.
I hope OldFatGuy stays. I have had comments deleted. It’s been a while, but if I remember, on one, I did not get a notice…just…poof! I truly thought it was an innocuous comment. The second time, I understood fully why. Point is, I think everybody has comments mod-noted or removed from time to time, and it is not a reason to leave.
SD and PW –
If anger is just the irrational expression of fear, why should we ever be angry with Bush, Cheney, Obama, etc? Why should we be angry over NDAA, drone assassinations of American citizens, the pending TPP, etc?
Why are people like Chris Hedges and Glenn Greenwald telling us to be afraid of what’s happening to our former Constitutional rights?
If someone broke in while you were at work and murdered all your cats, wouldn’t you feel anger rather than fear? (Independent of the fear that it might happen to some other defenseless pets.)
x2
I need my anger as I need my hope.
Thank you, Scarecrow.
Elsewhere on the rec list, David Seaton asks, “Why is the American left so useless?”
The fact that the brief disappearance of Wendy’s diary has spawned more comments, here and in jaango’s post, than did her diary itself goes partway toward an answer.
The fact that the left exists in cyberspace as the uneasy, not unwelcome but not exactly welcome house guest at sites like myfdl … that’ll get you closer.
Good diary, anyway. False alarm, wendydavis diary disappearance was not the banhammer.
BMWF – so, you created an account on FDL, and all you’ve done is insult the moderators and owners of FDL? Really?
Dysfunction thrives in silence. These issues need to be talked out, more light, not less. PW, it doesn’t help to pretend that different words all mean the same thing, a more careful analysis is warranted. Following the Cavlan kerfuffle, I posted my famous (infamous?) Clucking Hen diary, deliberately setting myself up as a lightning rod, so people could get all their emotions and venting out in the open, and maybe we could find a way to reconcile the differences and issues and be a community once again. I was attacked for being divisive, mostly by Old Guard players here who then continued to project their own angers and exclusionary pressures into the environment. So, now we are where we are, losing participants daily, and with a sour cloud over everything. We better have a good faith conversation soon about the differences betw the internal groupings, and some illumination of where management stands on the various issues involved, or I do not see a good future for this community, a community I have loved and supported since before the Iraq War.
Exactly!
Also, I saw Van Jones being interviewed on one of the news shows last night. Somewhat appropriately he expressed his concern about what might get rammed through Congress during the lame-duck session. But his concern was that we need to have tax increases and that Obama should threaten to veto any bill that doesn’t include tax increases.
But, the real threat is cuts to SS and Medicare in the sense of Simpson-Bowles. IMHO, Obama should threaten to veto anything that cuts benefits under these important programs. We can get all the tax increases we need by letting the Bush tax cuts expire.
No let’s not, let’s all take some deep deep breaths and then scream and scream and scream ’til we’re sick.
(Sorry PW but some temptations are quite simply irresistible).
mfi
Yup.
mfi
There used to be tons of really good commenters at FDL who brought value added to the discussion.
Ok. So Anger and Fear were born twins. From my research, I’d say the Mother was most likely Frustration, and the Father, John Edwards. (Midwived by Karl Rove, on a Caribbean yacht, with a camera.)
Roll the film a few years (skimming over that episode where young Anger and Fear – the artful toddlers – go to temple and beat the bewhiskery shit out of the Rabbi, rob the money-changers, then run giggling off to Vegas for the weekend) anyway, roll right past that, and we find Anger, all growed up, and ready to marry.
At which point emotional biographer Obey claims Anger would most likely marry up with A GOOD CAUSE?
Anyway, WTF, pugsly?
Because even if Anger DID marry that do-gooding moron, do you think they’d give birth to Righteous Indignation?
Not likely.
More like they’d give birth to Keith Olbermann or some other numbnuts. (Can I say numbnuts on here? After all, it’s a medical description of what I get sitting here reading all day. And not eating. Just drinking orangina. And peeing into this jug.)
(Also, damn, I hope I kept the jugs straight.)
Anyway, here’s how it went, properly reconstructed.
Anger has a rollicking sexual affair with Just The Wrong Type Of Guy, while Fear – the fraternal twin – goes one on one, well, one on two actually, with Ultra Violence and Rash Encounter.
Anger gets pregnant, as does Ultra Violence.
They give birth to an enormous Cat (named Alfie Thunderpants) and The National Debt, respectively.
The National Debt eats the Cat, Ultra Violence blames Fear for the disappearance and goes quite Ultra on him, removing Fear from the equation. Upon hearing the news of her twin, Anger has to be put into the Home for the Perpetually Quite Sad.
A Good Cause gets sold for parts, and Justice, Vindication and Integrity remain mere wisps, willo’thewisps in fact, i.e. even less wispy than a wisp, eat one and it’ll make you long for a good ole solid gut-filling wisp it would, like electing Obama when you could have had, say, Biden, like that.
Anyway, next thing is, Obama gets elected and it all goes straight to f*cking hell.
Still, guy has quality footwear, doncha think?
Anyway, all go to hell except for National Debt, who swells and swells – just like Mr Creosote in the Meaning of Life – til he couldn’t eat another wafer – but fortunately, National Debt gets saved. Taken off to fat camp by Karl Rove, where he loses 320 trillion pounds.
But still, every American, living and dead, past and future and also present, died in the writing of this story, and the world has inherited by Canadians and a couple of Swiss, who we don’t let out much.
THE End.
Wow. Cool.
This one time, at underwater blogging camp…
LOL! Dude, this is so not safe for work! I’m sitting here in the office laughing like a madman. Now trying to convince my colleagues that its really emotion research! :-)
My conciliatory diary on this general topic was just deleted! Well, I guess there is (once again) legitimate reason for paranoia about this place during the Obamney season:
Tough MyFDL Balancing Act (Or ‘Metalicious’)
2012-06-20 05:12:19
Not to get all ‘follow the money’ Marxist on you but I think the following is a reasonable way to boldly frame the issue here and at many ‘conventional progressive’ websites: there’s money in FDL/MyFDL as an Obama quasi-campaign site but there’s also money in the site’s role as a communication space for the many who are way to the left of Obama …
http://my.firedoglake.com/fairleft/2012/06/20/tough-myfdl-balancing-act-or-metalicious/
The diary advances the notion that, if everyone just behaves reasonably and acknowledges the difficult position FDL and Jane Hamsher are in, we might get through this tough patch with a community relatively intact …
On edit – Not directed at PW, but some of the comments here. Sheesh!
Depending on what kind of work you are actually doing, (esq?), you may have missed your calling. An excellent submission. ;-)
fairleft — there’s a misunderstanding about a rule, which we/FDL need to deal with. Your post was pulled until others could take a look. In my view, it’s fine. I’ve asked that it be reinstated.
Please be patient with us as we work through these issues, and in the meantime, don’t anybody kill/insult/defame/etc anyone else here, because we’re already outnumbered.
I have to get back to work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYWQAg12Ko0
ROTFLMAO and clapping!!!
Masterful, epic even. And if ya can’t say ‘numbnuts’ here, you could use
‘Eartha Kitt-fer-brains’ or even ‘Kuwaiti Tanker’; just sayin’.
We wanted the emotional family tree, Pug; we got it, lol!
(Thanks, Q.)
Hilariously, the next post on the list is called “Why is the American left so useless?” … too funny. I’m so totally sure that premise could not possibly be flawed aside, that one this are the only two posts with anything close to 100+ comments.
Drama drama. And again … this too shall pass.
Now you are just being vindictive. It all seems sooooo funny from your lofty perch in Canuckistan, eh? (On that big pile of fish all day … I’m not *surprised* you end up with numbnuts)
wigwam–
“O” is the one who is pushing for the cuts to Social Security.
I’m not much of a writer, granted, but will link to my short diary which links to O’s interview with the Washington Post editorial board BEFORE he even took the oath of office. He was explicit in it, about “reforming” Social Security.
Here you go: http://my.firedoglake.com/musiccitymollie/2011/10/02/the-devils-in-the-details/
Blue
The Moment of Truth (PDF), Bowles-Simpson Fiscal Commission
http://www.fiscalcommission.gov/sites/fiscalcommission.gov/files/documents/TheMomentofTruth12_1_2010.pdf
“there’s money in FDL/MyFDL as an Obama quasi-campaign site”…
Well that the big can of worms that needs to be opened up. FDL has claimed and is still claiming that they are “non-partisian”… that they have no favorite in the race…
Even though your statement appears to anyone who’s paying attention to be true.
The “claim” of being non-partisian… but then being overtly partisian… just does not jive… it doesn’t add up… and everyone knows it.
“Lofty” perch? Funny, how people mentally translate “North” into somehow being “up,” or “higher.” I mean, looked at from the point of view of God or the universe, I very much doubt that North somehow means higher, or morally superior. Although, in the interests of science, I should probably test your hypothesis.
* goes to window *
* flings open sash *
* looks around *
* looks down *
* looks down again *
* closes sash *
* returns to quality Apple product to communicate results *
Well, holy shit KGB, who knew?
What’s it like down there in that hell hole?
I got a ladder I could lend ya. Only $10 bucks. But that’ll be real money please.
Canadian.
Janes got a diary up.
Or…I could send ya both maps of North America for $20 each (gold dust); looks like kgb lives farther north than you do, lol.
Man; which o’ those jugs did ya give us to drink from? Whoosh; I feel strange. And whose child was Jealousy, anyway? (Just filling in the Tree drawing…)
No problem, and I’m happy the post has been restored to life.
Yeah, the diary’s point is that if the owner here and the participants just own up to the tricky dual reality of this place, then maybe we can all get through this Obamney campaign without all of us way to the left of Obama leaving pissed off and/or all the pro-Obama people leaving cuz all their posts are overwhelmed by anti-Obama comments.
This is a business we’re hanging out in, and the economics are probably pretty straightforward. No reason to pretend they don’t matter, and both sides of the equation should be recognized and given weight and leverage.
I don’t have a problem if some of the site overall is pro-Obama and some of it is way to the left of him. It’s a pretty big site, and it’s kind of good that the two clans are in the same neighborhood talking to and trying not to shout at each other.
Good grief; this still going on. Let me rant about making words mean what one wants them to mean instead of what the dictionary -the supposed authority of word meanings; anyone for scrabble?- indicates they mean. Such as the word “twin”
Is an emotion a ‘thing’? Not according to the scrabble authority.
When words are used to convey one’s unique thoughts without reflecting on what those words actually mean besides one’s own unique thoughts, ‘real’(a dubious proposition in itself) communication is hindered big time.
Let’s give the english language some respect and use words as commonly defined, not as our own idiosyncrasies would have them be defined.
Thank you, rant over and out.
Is there a response by you somewhere outlining your reasons for the action?
Lol. I *do* know the world is roughly spherical, dude. You totally missed the *real* intended stereotype … that in Canada, a high perch equals an exceptionally tall pile of fish! Sheesh.
Although, in retrospect, I *was* momentarily forgetting y’all have your own cross to bear in the form of Stephen Harper. Maybe it’s not all gumdrops, rainbows and free health care after all?
Oh. That ladder include shipping?