Between the dismal WaPo and the fading New York Times, we’re getting a growing number of stories reporting on extreme right wing fantasies as though they’re serious news, and not just absurd right wing fantasies. C&L’s Dave Neiwert picks up the conspiracy aspects on Countdown.
Today’s Times features a story on nullification. It seems there are a "growing number" of folks who are so enraged by the prospects of national health care reform that they’re considering state "nullification," a term that hasn’t been around since the Civil War.
The nut jobs still haven’t forgiven Lincoln for freeing the slaves, and they’re probably still unhinged about the income tax and Social Security, and don’t even mention allowing the "coloreds" to use our drinking fountains or attend our schools. But now the feds want to require us to purchase health insurance? That’s the tipping point, so it’s time to spark a Constitutional Confrontation and who knows what else.
Now, I’m not a fan of how Congress is proposing mandates to move towards greater coverage. But the notion that there’s no way the Constitution would allow Congress to structure a tax to pay for health insurance for another 30 million souls is ludicrous. If that were unconstitutional, Social Security and Medicare would have been ruled out decades ago.
Right wing extremists have always hung around the fringes of civilization, and in the darkest economic and political times, they can gain ascendancy and wreak terrible damage on a nation, its people and founding institutions. We are trying to emerge from one of these periods.
But it doesn’t follow that legitimate media need becomes so confused or intimidated by their bullying that news editors feel obliged to treat them as anything more than delusional nut cases. Yet for some reason, that is what they are doing.
Now that the editors of WaPo and NYT have been bullied into treating seriously people who never got over the Civil War, we’re seeing more and more of these stories on places other than Fox News. And every time that happens without a clear indication from the editors that they’re describing people who should never be regarded seriously and whose ideas are either stupid, dangerous or both, we lose another brick from the foundations.
More:
Jamison Foster, Media Matter, on WaPo ombudsman and ideological diversity
Digby, Fair and Balanced
Rick Pearlstein, Q&A on Acorn and Wapo
TPM, Right-winger compares US to Nazi Germany, Says "Buy More Guns"
Digby, A vast failure
Atrios, Big Papers All Agree: Need to Listen to Even Nuttier Rightwingers



72 Comments







The powers that be are begining to get nervous. There is talk of a claw-back on those folks who profited on Bernie Madoff’s pyramid scheme, there’s a judge who says we may revisit the details of the Merrill Lynch & Co bonuses prior to the sale to BofA, and there are people actually questioning not only the judgements, but the legality of some BushCo activity.
If you can’t start a civil war over these unreasonable calls for accountability, what good is it being rich and powerful?
If you can’t go out and shoot someone at the behest of the rich and powerful, what good is being angry and stupid?
Good observation I think we are closer to a Civil War than the GOP:)
Eveidently You don’t want healthcare, because with a civil war over it, the conservatives would win.
They have proven that by being able to muster their loonies to protest against it, and the other side has not even made a good case for it, let alone moving their butts to march for it.
People have to move their butts to fight for anything, and they aren’t willing to do that. That is why our Country is in such a mess, they won’t get off their butts to fight for the Country, by throwing out the bad politicians. A Country of the people, takes the people to run the Country, we have been content voting, and thinking that is doing our part. Only that has left the parties we voted for to decide, and run the Country for us. Any time You let someone else decide everything for You, without considering you, representing You, and caring what You want, You are being ruled, not represented.
We need revolution, not civil war. Revolution to replace the people who are ruining our Country, that we keep voting in, and doing as they damn well please after we elect them. The Congress, Not Presidents, Parties, or People, have held back healthcare. The Congress has caused every prolbem we have including the housing and banking crisis’s, and has not fixed one problem yet. But we are hoping these idiots are going to finally give us some kind of healthcare reform. We are waiting on the same people who caused the problems to fix them. This is asinine, but that is what the american people have been reduced to.
ot
Scarecrow Chris Matthews Hardball really had some meat to chew on tonight. Focused on the big question “will Israel attack Iran”
Then went low and focused on the let’s get Clinton for the blowjob but forget getting the Bush administration for the intelligence snowjob.
Unale to link from this computer. Lot’s of material on Hardball tonight
Wow… what RECKLESS talk this is!!!! I am so stunned by this. Chris Matthews and these guys are SO CAVALIER about nuclear war. And they are so strategizing for Israel more than reality check of what it truly means to all of the US. WOW. WOW. WOW.
“Netanyahu has to see something in three months.” It is like they are mapping out a video game. Or what? WAR???? Apparently. I don’t know if I am listening to tonight or last night on podcast at msnbc, but Matthews has his bright shiny object apparently and it happens to be WAR, a big one, as they shoot off their mouths as if they are talking about a sports game. Or a video game players … they make me crazed listening to them. And acting like total EMPATHY for Israel is a given. One guy talked about “taking Iran leadership out” like this country is run by Tony of the Sopranos. Mafia crony thuggery. I am horrified.
“Existential” motivation of Israel to declare war on Iran. WOW.
This is Iraq one more time. When are we gonna learn? MSM is ripening us to go down the garden path one more time. I would like to see these guys serve even one day in combat before they run their mouths off.
Maybe it is time to emigrate? Except they are talking nuclear. Climate change? These guys will take care of that problem. Just blow everyone up.
Sorry for going off. But I feel like I am being manipulated and set up for more international horror from US and Israel.
Scarecrow, great points. John Boehner was on Newshour announcing how AMERICA!!!!!! had the best health care already in the world… and Jeffrey Brown didn’t utter a word of protest. And on and on with the same old canards…. soft on terror and taxation and yada yada yada… and it is Pavlovian.
Jingoistic “truthiness” prevails. And we are getting fleeced by what Wendell Potter calls “wall street-run” health care which is burning us and bankrupting us… right now it is “bankruptcy for all” … but these guys are running around screaming the sky is falling if “government-run” health care moves in on us. What a bizarro world.
The xenophobia is so thick, God help anyone to have a molecule of EMPATHY for anyone outside their gated community self image.
Politicians posture they don’t want the stimulus $ and yet then they go around and distribute it like it is from their own pockets and ostrich citizens stay clueless. Was that Rick Perry or someone else Rachel talked about doing that.
WaPo and NYT … bullied. Our fourth estate is gone. Or has joined the other side, rather. Even worse.
The only way to get to universal coverage is to make healthcare a right, and that is single payer. Making it a mandate is fatally flawed. OTOH we have the nutcases coming out of the woodwork. On the other we have insurance companies scheming how to sell junk insurance in order to reap premiums from a captive market without actually having to deliver any real healthcare to those forced to participate in it.
Criminally corrupt politicians are the reason the U.S. is ranked near the bottom of every catagory when ranked next to other modern, industrialized nations. Time for publically funded elections.
The Congress is back in session and doing the dirty work for the Medical Industrial Complex.
mcconnell $3.3M, hatch $2.9M, baucus $2.8M, grassley $2.7M,
lieberman $2.6M, burr $2.4M, ensign $2.4M, cornyn $2.2M, kyl $2.1M,
conrad $2.1M, cantor $1.8M, boehner $1.7M, coburn $1.2M, j wilson 800K
were paid by the Medical Industrial Complex to kill Health Care Reform.
(Source: OpenSecrets.org)
Co-Author Dr. Steffie Woolhandler of a Recent Harvard Study on Annual Deaths of America’s Uninsured, says the lack of coverage can be tied to about 45,000 deaths a year in the United States. The only way to affordably cover all Americans is through a Medicare-for-All, Single-Payer System. A Single-Payer System would generate $300-$400 billion in administrative savings annually, enough to cover all of the uninsured, and to plug the gaps in coverage for Americans with only partial coverage. Obviously, Medicare-for-all is anathema to the insurance industry. What politicians are doing is saving insurance industry profits, by sacrificing American lives.
12 Million Americans were denied health care coverage by the Medical Industrial Complex because they had a pre-existing medical condition. 12K Americans are denied insurance coverage everyday by a for-profit Insurance bureaucrat. (Source: WaPo Article 05′ by Harvard Prof. E. Warren)
Medical malpractice lawsuits are a hot topic but, are they? Tort Reform is such a “Red Herring” and is easily disproved. A 2004 report by the Congressional Budget Office said medical malpractice makes up only 2 percent of U.S. health spending. Even “significant reductions” would do little to curb health-care expenses, it concluded.
bush(43) economic speech writer david frum, at least, is willing to admit the idea about selling insurance across state lines is a crock:
New Jersey health policies cost more in large part because New Jersey hospitals and doctors charge more. If I buy a cheaper Kentucky policy that reimburses my providers at Kentucky rates, leaving me to pay the balance, how much good does that do me? And if the Kentucky policy is made to pay New Jersey rates, there vanishes my low Kentucky price.
These are some of the easily refuted arguments bought and paid for by the Medical Industrial Complex to derail any chance of their criminally massive profits being reduced.
Follow the Money: Link
Call Congress and demand, Single-Payer Health Care for All!
(Toll Free # House and Senate)
1-866-338-1015 _____ 1-866-220-0044
1-800-473-6711 _____ 1-866-311-3405
Sign Single-Payer Petition: Link
Don’t let the Medical Industrial Complex steal your Health Care from you and your family by donating huge sums of money to Crooked Politicians in order to maintain the Status Quo. Keep up the good fight.
SEMPER FI!
Hey Navy Doc. I used your link and numbers in my post. Why don’t you do a diary?
http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/8335
Actually my linky was broke but stuff happens.
Thank you for the phone numbers which I called a few minutes ago. Thanks, Fellow Veteran.
Signed the single payer link too. Thank you
Wow, talk about coincidences! It’s also true that left-wing extremists have always hung around the fringes of civilization, and in the darkest economic and political times, they can gain ascendancy and wreak terrible damage on a nation, its people and founding institutions.
Not only that, but legitimate media become so confused or intimidated by their bullying that news editors feel obliged to treat them as something more than delusional nut cases.
Wow, what are the odds?
Stalin Hitler FDR there is a third choice I don’t see any death camps right or left in Obamas America if your side would stop lying well maybe you could reach some Moderate voters next election.
Citizen Mr. Cleaveland:
“It is also true that left-wing extremists have always hung around the fringes of civilization…”
No Brother Cleaveland, those left-wing extremists ARE civilization and they have always represented the great mass of humnanity and led the struggle against ignorance and terror that you and folks like you represent.
Great point art, philosophy music the Left way outnumbers the right in culture
What is Civilization without art?
Right or Left lies like the birther controversy, death panels etc can a political movement survive long term built on lies?
Citizen ThingsCome Undone:
“…can a political movement survive long term built on lies?”
Well, Christianity is very much alive lo these last few 2,000 years and fascism in America has survived a revolution and a civil war…history is nothing if it isn’t a struggle against lies and liars.
More red states than blue get more cash from the Federal Government that they pay in taxes if the red states leave they do know they would have to pay more taxes?
it’s the “squeeky wheel gets the greese” and they don’t let our wheels squeek at all
Saw what you wrote it was good
tee hee
you’ll have a lot of fun with that, they go scratching their heads
I remember one person said;
“perris, you say things I agree with even though we have differant points of view”
you really can break break through, it just takes giving them what they brung
Perris I’m a bit to logical for that enjoy your gift:)
All it takes to make the right wing fantasies come true are 4 like minded justices sitting on the supreme court. You don’t think the Roberts court would like refrain from revisiting some of those supreme court decisions in the 1930s that facilitated the new deal? People forget that for decades, the Supreme Court struck down many Congressional Acts as unconstitutional if it had a significant impact on American business.
This is the third time South Carolina has embraced nullification.
In 1833 Andrew Jackson came damn close to saddling-up and hunting down John C.Calhoun for propogating this “abominable doctrine.”
http://www.presidentprofiles.c…..ation.html
I often feel like I am observing a war tactic being played out on our country via the MSM. An information war is the first way to create divisiveness within the masses. Fringe ideas tend to be the ideas that are utilized for such a tactic. So, the MSM is responsible for the destabilization of our nation.
The wealthy gain quite a bit from distraction regarding the rule of law.
And don’t forget to scroll and make calls.
RightWingNoise ¦ /dev/null
AND THE KILLIN’GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Scarecrow and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:
Our “civil war” has been goin on since the institutionalization of slavery in the original Constitution…and the ideology that justified the “peculiar institution” and the political terrorism that kept it in place has been with us since the beginnin’. The struggle for social and economic justice and equal protection under law is ongoing and will never be over as long as money equals speech and freedom includes the power to inslave.
Mr. and Mrs. Clinton come from a long line of “liberals” who managed to survive the terrible attacks of money and power by selling out the mass of people in return for a place in the slave master’s kitchen. We have an opportunity at this moment to make a public access to the great river of history and get enough folks into the main current to really threaten the power of the old slavocracy and to leave the overseers and the house servants like the Clintons eating crumbs. But the advance won’t be without casualties and we can’t be satisfied with moments of victory…
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, THESE BASTARDS WON’T GO AWAY BY THEMSELVES!!
Scarecrow !
Will there be a liveblog here, of the Senate Finance Committee’s hearing ?
don’t know about the Lake, but there is a mothership live blog over at Big Orange already on the rec list
Rasmussen says that only 41% support Government Health Care. That number has been dropping like a stone and will continue to drop as Obama goes to Copenhagen for the Olympics instead of dealing with health care and the foreign policy crises confronting him. Progressives ask for nullification AND civil war if they oppose the people the way they have been. Incidentally, nullification is NOT unconstitutional. IT may have been defeated by the War Between The States but that does not mean that the legal doctrines underpinning it are wrong. Nullification may be the only way to prevent civil war.
Whoa Nellie!
The right wing’s ideas have been thoroughly discredited, but that doesn’t mean they’re out of the game. They’re playing their anger trump card. Don’t underestimate it.
In a related note, after an election that was seen as illegitimate by the people, Iran’s government is trying to shore up it’s support by stirring up international trouble. If Israel (or God forbid, the U.S.) launches any kind of military strike against Iran, Ahmadinejad knows the people will turn their anger away from him and toward the west.
Israel wants to play right into his hand, let’s hope Obama has more sense.
Norske
Petro
Citizen Raven:
Peace Brother Freebird.
There it is
Raven ! Norske !
Sorry, I had to take a call … how are you doing ?
We need a nuty left ot provide balance. Some Maoists or soemthing. The anarchists need to be covered in the WaPO and NYT. Equal time!
In their minds Michael Moore is further left than Mao and the Shining Path.
-G
Good Morning Scarecrow and Firedogs,
finally, Neiwert on my teevee !!! Olbermann and Maddow went through the Goons of August without David’s insight- so glad they are finally utilizing a prized resource
Scarecrow – all of your links are good ‘uns, thanks. I am partial to Pearlstein for succinctly nailing TradMed hides to the wall with one hand tied behind his back :D
well well, who’da thunk it?
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/…..town-hall/
My bold
I was right the more time we have to educate voters the more voters we get on our side despite GOP Media lies.
Update:
there will be a FDL Live Blog of the Senate Finance Comm. hearings:
HERE
cbl2 & Mr cbl !
Thankya kindly !
How is nullification the issue???
We have pushed equal rights for same-sex marriage at the state level for years in defiance of federal bans?
Where is the consistency???
I voted FOR Obama because of his opposition to the individual mandate… that was not a side issue for him… it was the basis of his anti-Hillary domestic platform campaign.
If we cannot support the concept that the government should not be able to force us to give our money to corporate interests (or our privacy in Patriot Act, or our bodies by taking away our right to an abortion)… what can we support?
Scarecrow— please help me understand how state-based same-sex marriage makes us any less ‘civil war’ era?
Over at the NYT, they’ve got one article on how wingnuts want to ban federal health care dollars from funding abortions.
And then they’ve got a second on states passing laws “banning mandates.” and containing this gem of reasoning:
Won’t ANYONE point out how insane these people are????
[I’ve tried for 15 minutes without success insert the links to these articles and get the links to work. I apologize for my technical incompetence.]
Ah, but screwing black people is what it’s all about. They resent every dime of their taxes that goes to social spending, because it might help black people in some way.
By the way: “Jury nullification” is something the right-wing militia and Posse Comitatus types holler about all the time.
Are you suggesting that if the bottom of our country’s economic ladder looked Nordic Single Payer would be law?
We have carried these fools long enough. Let them go. There is no need to do anything but put in a provision such that any State whose senators and representatives unanimously vote against public health insurance don’t get it. Period. Done. Die in the streets if you want to.
Lincoln was wrong. We should have let them go when a few hundred thousand stupid racist pigs fought their own country for the right of 1/10,000th of them to own others people and called it a fight for independence not even considering that without slaves they would have had more opportunities for paying jobs. A portion of this country has always been willing to give their lives for scum who wouldn’t spit on them. Let them go and good riddance.
If we had let them go then by now they would have drowned in their own urine and filth after they privatized sanitation and repealed the taxes to pay for it. If they don’t want public health insurance fine, they don’t get it. They don’t want any stiumulus next time around no problem, let them starve. They don’t want alternative energy let them store toxic waste in their backyards and keep paying Saudi Arabia to train people to kill them. Enough of this nonsense fighting a pack of crazy idiots to help them, to whatever extent it is legislatively possible let them go. And make some ways to help the sane ones move.
Thank you! It’s about time someone called bullshit on the MSM. One more thing; I wish we will start telling these “Bars and Stars” assholes that the South lost the
War of Northern AgressionCivil War. They committed treason, got thier asses kicked, and they should be a bit more humble. If push comes to a shove, the federal (Union) government will kick their asses again.That li’l rebellion? They like owning folks, don’tchaknow?
You ain’t just singing Dixie…
If push comes to shove, I think another Rasmussen poll shows the level of anger towards the Central Government is higher than it has ever polled. Perhaps another form of government with more power to the States and the Localities is the only answer.
No, the form of government we have is fine. It is politicians of doubious quality that we must, one by one, improve.
Petro
Raven
Norske
Namaste SD !
I think the average American is in information (propaganda) overload.
At this point they don’t trust anyone’s “facts and figures.” Maybe the same is true with a lot of editors.
Listen, if we have another Civil War can we have different colors? I think the blue and gray were kind of boring so how about chartreuse and magenta or something similar?
So, what’s wrong with secession? Instead of one very large corrupt banana republic, we’d have two smaller ones. Just make sure the war-mongering red states are not left with nukes. Oh! Maybe that’s a good reason to avoid secession: the lunatics would joyously start blowing up the world to force the second coming. -shivers- We need more asylums for the criminally insane. -nods-
And “up north” we are not immune from this type of thinking. Last weekend at a harvest festival 65 miles outside Chicago, a political candidate getting petition signatures was asked by a local, “when are you going to get rid of that spook in the White House?” The lunatics are emboldened by the noise machine to proudly display their ignorance.
I did not know the White House was haunted by ghosts.
But it doesn’t follow that legitimate media need becomes so confused or intimidated….
Aye, but there is the rub,imho.
Illegitimate media may be more appropriate.
Obama Derangement Syndrome. It’s a terrible thing to see.
It appears that the WaPo is doing some bullying of it’s OWN:
How I run afoul of Washington Post’s social media rules–and why – 21 hours ago
Yet the Washington Post, with its new social media guidelines, is attempting to corral every independent voice in its organization. …BusinessWeek – 33 related articles »
Ombudsman Blog – Post Editor Ends Tweets as New Guidelines Are IssuedSep 25, 2009 … Another section reads: “What you do on social networks should be presumed to …. Best guidelines for journalists on any media or at any public event or … Top Washington Post Editor Forced Off Twitter After Urging More …
voices.washingtonpost.com/…/post_editor_ends_tweets_as_new.html?… – Similar
WaPo’s Social Media Guidelines Paint Staff Into Virtual Corner …Sep 27, 2009 … WaPo’s Social Media Guidelines Paint Staff Into Virtual Corner; … The new policy was translated externally by WaPo ombudsman Andy Alexander on his … All Washington Post journalists relinquish some of the personal …
paidcontent.org/…/419-wapos-social-media-guidelines-paint-staff-into-virtual-corner/ – Cached – Similar
Washington
When Sen Sherrod Brown of Ohio had an electronic town hall meeting last month, he was asked this question: ” Where in the Constitution does it give Congress the right to mandate health care or provide public health care?” Sen Brown answered, with no hesitation, that Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution gives Congress the right to pass laws that promote the general welfare.
These right wing maroons are living in the 1850s, where blacks and women know their place. What are their cries for Pres Obama to show his identification but a throwback to the Fugitive Slave Act that required a black man to prove he wasn’t a slave. This Act is the basis for all the BS where a black man has to show more identification. They don’t believe any amendment to the Constitution after the 10th was legal. And worst of all, they think Jesus is telling them to do all this.
mocha, where does it say in the Constitution that an insurance industry has the right to provide health insurance to citizens?
I don’t think the Constitution says anything about what private companies do. But Article I, Sec 8 does give Congress the right to make laws that provide for the general welfare. That’s why they could create medicare, social security, and hopefully this year, a public insurance option. That’s why they can make laws that tell insurance companies what they may and may not do.
If the mandate is signed into law, the insurance industry should lose its expemtion from anti-trust rules and become regulated like utilities.
Nullification and interposition were both terms used during Civil Rights. Martin Luther King, in his “I Have a Dream” speech, described: “I have a dream that one day, down in Alabama, with its vicious racists, with its governor having his lips dripping with the words of interposition and nullification…”
While I believe Obama has been consistent on his campaign promises it hasn’t prevented the congress from exerting their will (for good or ill).
For example, on the health reform public option Obama stood against it and it helped him vis a via Clinton & Edwards, but this current legislation is being generated primarily by Congress. the House put in a public option with mandates and the Senate is hashing it over now with a major split appearing over whether to even have a public option.
It’s awfully appealing and very Liberal in spirit to try to cover everyone. That’s fine if you can do it and afford it. In our current economy and budgetary constraints I don’t think it’s impossible, but a strain. Then there are the conservatives who don’t like this interference in the free market (not that they mind the government exemption from anti-trust regulation and the extremely uncompetitive result).
How does all this wash out? Does the lcd win out by just saying “No”?
I think government deals aren’t pretty, but often necessary. I had hoped there was enough within the health reform where those compromises could be achieved. Now it appears not. Some senators from energy states (Landrieu and Conrad) are balking (despite knowing and saying we need this reform) and the Republicans are simply saying “NO” for political purposes (though several of them realize this reform is pretty good). So, I think what will have to happen is a compromise deal which goes beyond the health reform into the energy area. We get health reform with a PO and they get something they want in energy. Of course, we have to have guarantees they will vote for our bill, so the health reform has to go through before our side would be committed to do anything.
I don’t especially like this kind of horse trading since it’s more complicated, but it’s not illegal or immoral, just complicated. Anyway, I think that to get the kind of energy reform we want there was bound to be deal-making. The House Cap&Trade was simply not going through without a lot of horse-trading.
This is sausage-making. If you’re nauseated just look away.
Now, where’s that picture of Sarah “of the North” Palin with that turkey and chainsaw?
I wonder if Louisiana needs more windmills to capture all the electricity that could be generated when hurricanes come in from the Gulf.