Cross examination of David Blankenhorn by David Boies.
[missed the beginning of this, due to site connection issues]
Boies: Do you think that heterosexual marriages will decline if same sex marriage is legal?
Blankenhorn: Cites a study….
Q: I need to have you focus. My question is different: does any scholar you rely on has asserted that legalizing same sex marriage will result in a decline in heterosexual marriage?
WALKER: Don’t argue with one another [this has gone on fo rsome time]
Q: Do any of the scholars you’ve relied on say that legalizing same sex marriage with cause a decline of heterosexual marriages?
A: I cannot answer if only yes or no.
Walker: Do you know?
A YEs I do know, can you ask me again?
Q Have any of the scholars you’re relied on asserted said that they believe that permitting same sex marriage will result in a reduction of heterosexual marriages?
A: … controibute to the deinstitutionalization of marriage, although not sure they have made the direct assertion.
Q: Mr Blankenhorn –
A: See thast wasn’t so long.
WALKER: I’m going to take that as an I Don’t Know, would that be fair?
A: I do know the answer, I gave my answer
WALKER: The record is very clear what you said.
Q: You have said some scholars claim a deinstitutiojalization of marriage, which might then lead to reduced heterosexual marriage rates, right?
A: Yes sir
Q: The linkage, though, was that something the scholars said, or you?
A: What scholars?
Q: What scholars have said the deinstitutionalization of marriage will lead to lowr marriage rates
A: WOuld you like me to name one?
Q: I would like you name ALL OF THEM you know of
A: Well it will take me a moment to compose my list
Q: Let’s be sure you understand I want to know scholars who — first — claim permitting same sex marriage would deinstitutionalization of marriage and second that that deinstitutionalisation woul dlead to less het marriages
A: Oh, you want me to name scholars? The universe you are limiting me to are the scholars I relied on, Dr Norville Glenn, one of the most distibguished family scholars in the nation.
Q: Are there other scholars
A: I don’t want to limit them to this –
Q: Your honor, please, he listed several scholars he relied upon, and now he says some are illustrative.
WALKER: MR Blankenhorn, I think he wants the names
A: names another one, some Rutgers guy
Q: He has written ONE then TWO?
A: I am not sure the form of his words satisfy your strict qualifications without reference to his works, so I want to issue that caveat, but if he were sitting right here (passionately!!) that he would answer YES THOSE ARE ME BELIEFS
Q: not what is in their heart or mind, but what they have actually written, not what you believe they migh saym but what they have ACTUALLY WRITTEN. DO you know the differnce?
A: Of course I do.
Q: So did Dr Oppenau write something where he said, ONE (deinst) and TWO (lead to the decline of hetero)
A: Toi the best of my ability
Q: Can you just answer MY question
A: I am trying to, I came all the way from new York to answer your questions
Q: Well then can you answer my question
A: Again I am not sure if he has written ONE *deinst* and *lessening rates*
Q: REading Norville Glenn while we talked, I don’t see anything about lessening heterosexual marriages rates.
A: It was in a paper
Q: Did you rely on that paper
A: I don’t recall –
Q: Why don’t you look?
A: It never occurred to me that everything I say had to be represented in the documents listed in the report!!!
WALKER: the question is: is it listed in the things you cinsidered when you made your report
Q: Is it listed
A: I did not know that every view I expressed had to be linked to a document I relied upon.
Q: I do want to followup on something you just said.
A: I just did not know that was what was expected (whining now, not a good expert in any way shape or form)
A: No it isn;’t listed
Q: At the end of your expert report, you prepared a list of things you relied on. Dr Glenn’s article was not there, was it.
Q: There is a Norville GLenn articel, a different article.
A: yes, it’s a different article.
Q: Maybe the easiest way to approach this is to go through the materials you went through with Mr Cooper, I’ll try to be as fast as I can
Q: Let’s look at this book of Dr Frazier.
Q: Has she said that same sex marriage would cause a decline of hetero marriages
A: In the intersts of moving aloing, I will say that I am unaware of any writings of Suxanne Frazier on the topic of same sex marriage.
Q: Okay, what about Professor Quayle, has she said anything about the impact of same sex marriages on the frequency of hetero marriages?
A: Again, I don’t think she ever talked about that. She’s under the section of What is Marriage, never talked about same sex marriage or deinstitutionalization.
Q: Maybe we can move this along, then.
Neither Prof Frazier, Quayle, Davis, Royal Anthropoligical institute, nor prof vandenburg, nor prof melanowski — none of them talk about, as far as you relied on, about same sex marriage, or the deinstitutionalization of marriage?
A: I wouldn’t say that
Q: Well that didn’t work, I know that was compound, but I guess I can’t speed it up
Q: Prof Frazier: deinsti or same sex marriage, yes or no
A: long answer, Walker throws up hands,
Walker: Can you answer the question yes or no please
Q: Prof Quayle?
A: well sometimes when he speaks he talks about deinstitutionalization.
Q: Begin with yes or no, you ended that long speech with a yes.
A: That wasn;’t a long speech
Q: lets not argue about the length of your answers, my questions are deisgned to be YES or NO or I DON"T KNOW.
A: No sir, I know the answer I wish to give, if the only words I can choose are yes or no.
Q: When I ask "Does Mr Kinglsley Davis address deinsti or same sex marriage, you can answer that yes or no.
A: Well no I can’t.
Q: Well, what about the article you relied on of his?
A: I don’t know!
Q: There! I knew I could get it!
A: But in this case the answer really is I DON’T KNOW.
[this is a complete and utter implosion of this 'expert witness' in both style and substance. utter.]
Q: GO to the Royal Society report, address deinsti or same sex?
A: I know for a fact it does not discuss same sex marriage. But it is my belief that it does specifically or in substance discuss the deinsti.
Q: Can you show me where?
A: I only have a few pages here, I need the whole book
Q: WE are getting you that
Q: With regard to MR Vandenburg, did you rely on him for deinst or same sex marriage?
A: I have tried to tell you that I relied upon him fo rthe definition o f mariage.
Q: THat’s whast I am trying to find out.
Q: TO the extent that Prof Davis addressed deinsti of marriage, he did so outside your book or the publication you listed?
A: Certainly it was outside my report
Q: I meant outside your binder
A: Yes, your statement is corrent
Q: NOw prof malenowski, the ublication in your binder, does he deal with either ssmarriage or the deinstitutionaliztion of marriage?
A: That would not be correct
Q: Does malenowski deal with ssmarriage
Q Does he talk about deinsti of marriage?
A: In his writing as a whole
Q: The question was In the materials you relied upon, in those materials in your binder, does he deal with the deinst of marriage?
A: I don’t know
Q: Tab 10, Levi Strauss?
A: I think I can say at this time he doesn’t talk about same sex marriage and I don’t know if he talks about deinsti of marriage
Q: Do you have others by Levi-Strauss in your list?
A: I am quite confident I listed on ly this artcile, althoug I’ve read him extensively and relied on his work thoroughout my work.
Q: Canada report?
Q: Reduction of heterosexual m arriage when same sex marriage implemented?
A: I don’t know
Q: INcrease in heterosexaul divorce rates
A: My strong suspicion is they did not because they are endorsing the radical deinstitutionalization of marriage. I would strongly speculate they m ade no such finding.
Q: These materials you relied on, did they say it would be a trend towards polygamy? That’s a YES NO or I DONT KNOW
A: I beleive –
Q: YOUR HONOR
Walker: Can you answer this?
A: I don’t know
Q: Your honor –
WALKER: I wonder whether in view of the hour that a good night’s sleep might help with this line of questioning.
Boeis: What a wonderful idea!
WALKER: Can we wrap this up in the morning, before noon?
B: Let me check
(checks with team)
B: Your honor, I will try to sharpen my questions and perhaps you can sharpen your answers.
Walker: Mr Cooper are youplanning to call Mr SChubert?
Cooper: Not if we can work out these issues about documents, your honor.
WALKER: Very well we will resume at 8:30 tomorrow morning with the intention and goal of completing before lunchtime.
SEE YOU WEDNESDAY MORNING!