Just before meeting with him to radicalize him and ‘operationalize’ his terror plans, the FBI claims it blocked Mohamed Osman Mohamud, 19, a naturalized United States citizen, from traveling within the country to accept employment.
Mr. Mohamud was then placed on a watch list and stopped at the Portland airport in June 2010 when he tried to fly to Alaska for a summer job.
Later in June, aware of Mr. Mohamud’s frustrated attempts to receive training as a jihadist overseas, an undercover agent first made contact with him, posing as an associate of the man in Pakistan. On the morning of July 30, the F.B.I. first met with Mr. Mohamud in person to initiate the sting operation.
So, after blocking his domestic travel to accept work in Alaska, the FBI began their aggressive contacts with this ‘terrorist’ who’d seen his employment prospects dashed. Certainly, a newly unemployable youngster would be more amenable to their entreaties, right?
And certainly such a youngster would attempt to impress a more senior jihadist, as he was led to believe his FBI contact was, with his terrifying articles about, um, physical fitness?
In his initial meetings with the undercover agents, Mr. Mohamud described his dreams of joining the jihadist cause, and mentioned articles he had written on the subject.
Mr. Mohamud told the agents that in 2009 he had published three articles on the Web site Jihad Recollections, which was edited by a Saudi-born American, Samir Khan, from a home in North Carolina. Mr. Khan moved to Yemen, where he runs Inspire, an English-language Web site, on behalf of Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.
One of Mr. Mohamud’s articles was titled “Getting in Shape Without Weights” and described the need to “exercise the body and prepare it for war.”
Reading the FBI’s description to the New York Times of what happened and how the plot ‘developed’ it’s almost impossible not to wonder how much this single young man, with no overseas or domestic terror contacts whatsoever, could have possibly accomplished in operationalizing his ‘plan’ without FBI assistance, encouragement, resources, and aggrandizement:
For the next several weeks the F.B.I. let the plot play out, assisting Mr. Mohamud with the details, providing him with cash, scoping out a parking spot near the square, sketching out the plan on paper. At the end of September, Mr. Mohamud mailed bomb components to agents he thought were fellow operatives who would assemble the device.
Planning to leave the country afterward, he sent passport pictures to the undercover agent. On Nov. 4, Mr. Mohamud went with undercover agents to a remote spot where they exploded a bomb in a backpack.
They then drove to his apartment, where he made a video full of apocalyptic phrases. “Explode on these infidels,” he said, in mixed English and Arabic.
On Tuesday, according to the affidavit, Mr. Mohamud and the undercover agents met again for final preparations, loading what seemed like parts of a bomb into a vehicle, planning details of the operation. He even told the agents the pseudonym he had chosen for the passport to be used in his escape: Beau Coleman.
On Friday, Mr. Mohamud and the undercover agents drove to the square, where the police had made sure a parking space had been held open. Mr. Mohamud then dialed the number that he thought would set off the bomb. Nothing happened. He was told that to get better reception, he should step out of the car to dial again.
Finally, the authorities describe the suspect as having ‘acted alone’ which is quite ludicrous given the serious operational and state-sponsored assistance the United States government applied to Mahamud’s plan, having seen to it that he wasn’t employed in Alaska:
Although Mr. Mohamud’s arrest marks another episode in which a Somali-American has been accused of radical attempts at violence, there was no evidence that Mr. Mohamud had any current link to Somalia or was a sympathizer of the Shabab, a militant Islamic group in Somalia. And despite Mr. Mohamud’s contacts with militants abroad, officials said he appeared to have acted alone in his pursuit of the bombing here.
His case resembles several others in which American residents, inspired by militant Web sites, have tried to carry out attacks in the name of the militant Islamic movement only to be captured in a sting operation.
The question remains: what scares Americans more, actual terror or state-sponsored ‘terror’ in the guise of a sting?



98 Comments

egad teddy, they cut him off from gainful employment and he sure as hell did not act alone — the fbi were his co-conspirators and actively encouraged and participated in the criminal enterprise
this whole thing reminds me of the tsa security theater at the aiports — intended to hype more fear fear ear
recommended
The very sad tale of an immigrant family trying to cope with their son being seduced into terrorism by our own federal government, at the end of the linked NYT story, is tragic:
============================================================
In the modest apartment complex in Beaverton, next to a commuter rail line, where Mr. Mohamud’s family is believed to live, no one answered the door on Saturday. Voices could be heard inside, but a handwritten sign taped to the door warned against solicitors and trespassers.
“They’re not going to answer,” said Itzel Barajas, who lives in the apartment across the outdoor hallway at the complex, Merlo Station Apartments.
Bahja Osman was one of several Somali women who visited the apartment.
“We feel very, very sad,” Ms. Osman said. “That’s why we’re coming — as a peace.”
Ms. Osman said she met Mr. Mohamud’s mother, whose first name she and several others said was Mariam, when they lived at a different apartment complex nearby. She said the Mohamud family came to Oregon several years go “to study, everybody, to go to school and to live.”
Ms. Osman said Mr. Mohamud’s mother was very upset.
“I didn’t believe it,” Ms. Osman said of the news that Mr. Mohamud had been arrested. “She’s surprised, too.”
=========================================================
How very coincidental that PDX is one of the airports without the Rapiscan porno-scan machines — purportedly scheduled for installation in 2011.
Our taxpayer dollars hard at work again…! 8-(
What a crock of crap…! Sounds like the FBI has too much time on it’s hands, since they’re not investigating the real villians like the Vampire Squid and all the Banksters…!
Recommended reading.
Classic strategy and manipulation for boiling frogs. This is the best the PMMI (Prison-Medical-Military-Industrial Complex) will ever offer you:
“[..] jetting around the world, killing human beings and being paid vast sums of money?”
- Bill in “Kill Bill vol. 2: Bill meets the Bride in Two Pines” (link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BN2C4Xccl7Q )
Good Lard – this makes Kafka look like a piker.
Oh, yeah, and “Change we can believe in.” rah.
People always say that terrorist movement can’t get a foothold in America because of our economic opportunities. Of course, the New Normal Economy may change that, but certainly blocking the chance to travel for a job will yield some bright young disaffection not unlike that found in France outside the ring roads, what?
Very Manchurian Candidate
Oh, for crying the fuck out loud, Teddy. Are you really going to suggest it was inappropriate to put this guy on the no fly list?
Thanks Teddy.
This is just a symptom of the general problem we seem to be having with our elite.
Do you believe in “wind-’em-up, release and catch” games? If someone’s got messed up ideas, you help them not set them up and use them.
Does that mean, “Yes: it was inappropriate to put this guy on the no fly list?”
What was the evidence they had at the time for putting him on the list? That he emailed a person who later went from Qatar to the northwestern territories of Pakistan — ONE TIME? Really? That disqualifies you from catching a domestic flight to begin employment?
Yes, I am so suggesting.
Just what is the criteria for the “no fly for you list”?
Feel the fingers tightening around the throat yet.
Glenn Greenwald has a nice write-up about this.
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/11/28/fbi/index.html
Teddy, Teddy, Teddy! You know, that when there’ a supply of real terrorists, we just have to go and manufacture some to meet the quota.
stewartm
Sheeit, I seem to recall once upon a time this would fit the classic definition of “entrapment”… having the police provide the materiel support and ideas to someone who might have otherwise not been disposed to commit a crime.
How very 1970s of me. You know, back when we were just getting over the nascent police state of Tricky Dick.
Also, I guess it didn’t hurt that the guy had a “funny” name, gee anyone else with a funny-sounding name in public life these days who’s murdering the Constitution for a public wage?
http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2010/11/several-federal-lawmakers-invested.html
“Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) disclosed possessing the most stock in L-3 Communications — with a minimum investment of at least $500,000 and a maximum value of $1 million. The L-3 Communications stock is fully owned by his wife, Teresa Heinz, according to federal financial disclosure reports.”
So the FBI is creating a terror threat to keep themselves employed rather than go after real crime?
I guess brown bombers get you the promotions.
What has this to do with this thread? Off subject. Write a diary.
Just what kind of leadership what kind of culture does the FBI have that they think this is the way to stop crime?
Do they tempt poor at risk virgins in Bible Belt states with date rape drugs too?
Do they ignore florida pain pill mills because hey at least the money spent is not going to drug lords?
Worse than that. If this young man had got the summer job in Alaska, would he have continued to be disaffected and alienated for the economy?
It takes opportunity to become a member of society. What do we expect if we bar opportunities? Race riots as in LA (That’s so 20th century)? Now disaffection, due to the media spotlight and education of the dissatisfied, can magnify and manifest itself in millions of tiny cuts.
How many other disaffected young men are similarly seduced and exploited by “law enforcement” for its own ends?
What gets me is the Feds are bragging about this like this proves they can stop terror and keep America safe. What gets me is the timing which seems just in time to save the porno scanners Christmas flying season is coming.
In a court room, if the defense or prosecutor “LEAD” the witness in their questioning (suggest a possible answer for the witness), the opponent will ask to judge to strike the question.
Seems to me that the FBI “LEAD” the witness all the way on this one. Can’t see how the FBI’s case will hold, given the “leading” they gave the subject.
How many other disaffected young men are similarly seduced and exploited by “law enforcement” for its own ends?
Everybody with a felony and given the color difference in sentencing and the choice to prosecute .
It has to do with the thread, because they want to create terror events to justify placing scanners all over the place…malls, trains, probably tree lighting events…in order to sell more scanners. If members of Congress are financially invested…well then. If you don’t like the info, don’t pay any attention to it.
LS
If I understand this correctly, the FBI is training young men in how to carry out an attack. That sure seems funny!
You’re on a roll Teddy! Keep’em coming!
Thanks for highlighting this story Teddy. The United States continues to throw its weight around and ruin the lives of people all across the globe in our pathetic attempt to force people to live by our rules, something which we ourselves are incapable of doing. We deserve all the scorn we are getting.
While not outright entrapment, this looks more like a classic case of ‘grooming’. Find a disaffected, vulnerable target and prey on their weaknesses and grievances. This whole scenario looks like it was designed and facilitated to snag this guy. It doesn’t sound like he had the ability to pull it off on his own. The FBI supplied everything from encouragement to materials and equipment. The whole thing smells bad.
Or… A problem that our “elite” seem to be having, living in a free country.
Yeah, and it’s so ironical (even though irony died with Bush v. Gore) that there are so many “disaffected” young men (and women) in the Islamic countries we invade, both pre-and-post-invasion who are marginalized and easily radicalized. Isn’t this sometimes referred too as a “death spiral”?
Has the FBI ever done this sort of sting with members of other groups, outside of standard criminal enterprises? It seems like groups along the lines of the Right to Life movement would be full of candidates ripe for this sort of grooming.
The US government takes many US teenagers, turns them into dedicated Muslim killers and then we call the results patriots. The US government spends how many man-years turning one teenager into a bomber thus setting him up for a lifetime in prison and we call the result a terrorist. (Results vary.)
I sure ‘hope’ the US doesn’t run out of teenagers for industrious terror-warfare adults to influence in their various ways. It’s one of the more sordid aspects of the war on terror, if you ask me, when one considers what teenagers ought to be doing instead.
I have a real problem with this “Surprise, you’re on a no-fly list!” activity– especially given that American airports are designed as law-free zones as *again* recently demonstrated by the TSA.
Is plane travel between Oregon and Alaska legally considered international travel? On first glance, many Americans may think it’s interstate travel.
How devastating. This is America – tear down the safety net keeping families secure, then seduce and betray the vulnerable to feed the prison and terror industry? Sickening.
There is an old Playboy joke from the ’60s that come to mind:
I read long ago that one of the reasons there were young jihadis from Saudi Arabia is that so many young men in particular had received educations but then had no employment, Saudi Arabia is/was full of un and under-employed young men.
It worked in Saudi, why not in the US?
What a tragic and terrible crock of shit for this man and his family.
By “feed the prison and terror industry” you are referring to the US military correct? Peace
The FBI ought to be commended here. Those who think, “what if he had only been able to get a job” or some such scenario dont properly weigh the what if, instead of the FBI, the militants had beat the FBI to the punch. I have no problem with what the FBI did here.
Bingo. We have institutions built upon those of the slavery days and they are still operating but with an even uglier, “privatized” twist. The reason to understand the systems in detail is so we can change them, make our collective lives and future better and live up to our full potential as human beings, Americans and people of this planet. The more we unravel these travesties the less we hold the concurrent systems of injustice in place. Migrants risking their lives for the American opportunity are literally getting chopped up for it (see my post “Realities of Circular Migration: “The Invisibles,” a film with Amnesty International” link: http://my.firedoglake.com/mzchief/2010/11/26/realities-of-circular-migration-the-invisibles-a-film-with-amnesty-international ). We have a responsibility to ourselves and to them to stop this.
I have to issue an apology to Teddy on this story. Been tracking it the last 24 hours and yeah, this kid was setup pretty badly by the FBI. I thought he was a foreign born national transplanted to the USA with extremist contact before the move. No, this kid was a citizen growing up here with his parents, any contact he had outside of the country (with organizations) would have been minimal. An elaborate 18 month sting on this kid was a waste of resources (though had this been a ‘real’ terrorist I still think this is the way to go in fingering these individuals.)
This kid was crazy and homocidal, but this level of program and expendature was totally unnecessary. He should have been in a mental ward 15 month ago instead of propped up as a poster boy of CTU success. He’s got problems and should be off the streets, but Osama Bin Laden 2.0 he is not.
I’d say this system as been “McDonaldised” (reference: the Australian produced film, “Business Behind Bars” (2000), link: http://www.roninfilms.com.au/feature/595.html ; also touched upon in “Prison Nation(s): An Overview,” link: http://my.firedoglake.com/mzchief/2010/11/20/prison-nations-an-overview ).
You appear to be endorsing the concept that the purpose of the FBI is to manufacture Federal detainees.
How do we know it was only an “18 month cultivation period”? I’d like a full investigation of this with everyone under oath and on the legal record– all openly available to the public.
As long as you don’t land in Canada it’s interstate travel, just like going to Hawaii.
Just like the bad old USSR, we’re coming to where we need to not just show not just ID, but our “permission slips” to visit Granny or get a new job in another state.
And evidence.
Hey, no need for an apology. Everyone very much wants to believe state agents act in our own interests all the time. It’s very discouraging and disappointing to realize they have their own agenda: growing their bureaucracy, burnishing their credentials, keeping the public fearful.
I’m glad you’ve come to share my view that this was an FBI plot, grown and nurtured by federal employees with a hapless dupe at its center.
Don’t hold your breath.
But, yes, that would be great. Perhaps our Mayor, Sam Adams, will insist on that before rejoining the Joint Terrorism Task Force that Portland so showily withdrew from five years ago.
My partner took one look at the kid and yelled, “Fetal Alcohol.” She really doesn’t think he’s competent. If so, he could have been a very easy dupe, particularly for the FBI.
I’m also reminding folks that they need to be active and assert themselves on these matters. After all, it appears to me that not doing so in a constructive way played a part in creating this collective mess.
It doesn’t have to do with the thread.
There are a lot of people who will believe them, because they’re Good Guys and don’t lie in court either. (You’d be surprised how many people think that law enforcement officials are Always Right.)
As long as he didn’t have any warrants out on him, I don’t see how someone can be punished for not having been convicted – let alone formally accused of – doing anything. People who the government isn’t accusing of crimes shouldn’t be put on things like the no-fly-list.
I suppose it’s okay to toss the kids parents in Guantanamo if they try to keep the FBI away from the kid, too.
I’m seeing several entries at the Portland Mercury’s BlogTown (link: http://blogtown.portlandmercury.com/blogs/BlogtownPDX ). Nothing further at Willamette Week yet– it appears.
According to the Daily Mail Reporter (UK) (“Somali-born teenager held over U.S. ‘car bomb’ plot after tip-off from someone concerned about him” updated: Nov. 28, 2010, link: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1333576/Somali-born-US-teenager-held-car-bomb-plot-Oregon-Christmas-tree-lighting.html#ixzz16bUb3IEc ) this happened:
“Yelling ‘Allahu Akbar!’ – Arabic for ‘God is great!’ – he tried to kick agents and police as they went to arrest him, according to prosecutors.”
All this has proved is there’s lots reason nations need a real mental health system.
Check this out:
‘“Everywhere there’s a U.S. post, there’s a diplomatic scandal that will be revealed,” Manning wrote. “It’s open diplomacy. World-wide anarchy in CSV format. It’s Climategate with a global scope, and breathtaking depth. It’s beautiful, and horrifying.’
“Uncompelling WikiLeaks Responses” by By: Spencer Ackerman Sunday November 28, 2010 10:15 am (link: http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2010/11/28/uncompelling-wikileak-responses ).
Unless the US has a presumed guilty until proven innocent policy – which it seems we do.
White conservatives are hard working, real americans. so no.
Hey… instead of the FBI recruiting/shopping for terrorist suspects at Portland area high schools, they should go to the Special Olympics instead.
Lots of potential trusting dupes for the FBI to recruit at the Special Olympics.
Not so much Manchurian Candidate as The Parallax View
Hey everybody, Liz Cheney is back:
“Senators, Liz Cheney want WikiLeaks leakers prosecuted” By David Edwards, Nov. 28th, 2010, 11:49 am (link: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/11/graham-cheney-wikileaks-prosecuted ).
In September in the mail I received a survey package b/c I’d agreed to participate, and they enclosed five dollars. There were two booklets, one, a large one with many pages of questions about my consumer/wireless/Internet/lifestyle activities. The other TV Guide-size booklet wanted me to record as a diary every TV program/station I would watch for at least 5 minutes, for a week’s time. On the last pages of the TV diary is the following questionnaire.
Remember The Parallax View? This questionnaire looks suspiciously like that movie’s cut-out firm’s method of screening its applicants for assassins.
It’s not long, but only looks long here on this blog’s IM format. There are 35 ‘opinionated’ statements; notice that only four don’t begin with ‘I’, and which those four are.
Here it is, verbatim:
Your Opinions
We are interested in your attitude about a number of topics. There are no right or wrong answers, just answers that describe you best. Please indicate how much you agree or disagree with each of the following statements by marking the box that best describes how you feel.
______________________________________
Mark (X) only one box for each statement.
Disagree Agree
__________________ __________________
Mostly Somewhat Mostly Somewhat
[ ] [ ] [ ] [ ]
[Those choices above were to the right of each of the following statements.]
I am often interested in theories.
I like outrageous people and things.
I like a lot of variety in my life.
I love to make things I can use every day.
I follow the latest trends and fashions.
Just as the Bible says, the world literally
was created in six days.
I like being in charge of a group.
I like to learn about art, culture, and history.
I often crave excitement.
I am really interested in only a few things.
I would rather make something than buy it.
I dress more fashionably than most people.
The Federal government should encourage
prayers in public schools.
I have more ability than most people.
I consider myself an intellectual.
I must admit that I like to show off.
I like trying new things.
I am very interested in how mechanical
things, such as engines, work.
I like to dress in the latest fashions.
There is too much sex on television today.
I like to lead others.
I would like to spend a year or more
in a foreign country.
I like a lot of excitement in my life.
I must admit that my interests are
somewhat narrow and limited.
I like making things from wood, metal
or other such material.
I want to be considered fashionable.
A woman’s life is fulfilled only if she can
provide a happy home for her family.
I like the challenge of doing something
I have never done before.
I like to learn about things that may
never be of any use to me.
I like to make things with my hands.
I am always looking for a new thrill.
I like doing things that are new
and different.
I like to look through hardware or
automotive stores.
I would like to understand more about
how the universe works.
I like my life to be pretty much the
same from week to week.
Many people seem to be assuming Mohamud would have sat in bitter impotence and never harmed a fly, but are there any reasonable grounds for that assumption? The guy was looking for someone to train and equip him. I imagine the people of Portland are glad the FBI didn’t wait for him to find the real thing…
“What was the evidence they had at the time for putting him on the list? That he emailed a person who later went from Qatar to the northwestern territories of Pakistan — ONE TIME?”
No, that he emailed a person asking how he could travel to Pakistan and join the fight for jihad
Teddy, there are legitimate questions concerning the FBI’s tactics: for example, has anyone here asked how the FBI was “tipped off”? NSA monitoring outgoing US e-mails, perhaps? You can put on a case worth considering, provided you don’t lose credibility by ignoring facts that don’t suit you.
Or by engaging in silliness like pretending that losing a summer job drove him to attempt mass murder.
What scares Americans more – and makes them more susceptible to other fears – is longterm unemployment, the knowledge that any employment is terminable without cause at the whim of an employer, and that even if employed, the money is rarely able to last more than paycheck to paycheck, let alone allow for reasonable planning for the future or for one’s children’s future. Unless of course, one makes more than $250,000 and has great hopes that a supine Mr. Obama will lead Congress into terminating the estate tax and enacting more tax cuts for the rich.
Pure speculation, worse than worthless.
What we’ve learned:
It’s not too hard to find and manage someone, and get him to commit a heinous crime of mass murder.
US law enforcement agents can do it.
Now there is proof (of concept) to support any number of theories about other crimes, including assassinations.
Now this.
Hey, maybe it began as a genuine nefarious rogue-cop project to commit mass murder and blame Muslims, but was discovered early on as such, and the rogue types were also duped by the good guys.
Maybe it’s a wikileaks kind of theater — coincidentally taking place between the JFK murder anniversary and the embarrassing WikiLeaks disclosures, its purpose being to expose the true conspiratorial coups d’etat in our 20th-century’s history if we know where to look. That is, someone or other might know and be ready to serve as a deep throat. Look at it this way: This incident happened at this moment in Portland, Oregon, where John Reed grew up and was active as a Socialist before he went to Moscow to cover the Revolution. Warren Beatty portrayed him in Reds. Warren also played the journalist in The Parallax View, who wasn’t smart enough to save himself or expose the facts and the truth.
The whole concept of the FBI putting someone on a secret-squirrel no-fly list for financial and other manipulations of a target… *Everybody* should be asking a barge full of questions.
If you are in a consolidated media environment directed out of the WH (EmptyWheel et al’s exquisitely precise trial blogging recorded this fact), then you *are* seated in a theater. How many folks realize this? How many still don’t know this?
“I imagine the people of Portland are glad the FBI didn’t wait for him to find the real thing…”
Wow, I’m surprised you’d admit to not wanting the FBI to catch the “real thing.” I guess I just take terrorism more seriously and so want a little bit of time taken to catch the “real thing” instead of the government just doing headline-grabbing arrests. The government should spend its time going after the “real thing,” not Nielsen ratings!
I think it does but IsIs should have explained how it fits in the thread like he/she did in their second comment.
Isis write like we don’t know know everything about this or any other issue explain stuff more I’m guilty of this too:)
How many unemployed Tea Baggers want a ~~~Edited by Moderator~~~? Your theory of law enforcement is funny.
If I was married would the feds send a drunk half nakid woman knocking on my door to catch me?
We are all tempted bombing people does not tempt me but there is looking at other women and well shoving opportunity in our faces.
~~~Mod Note: Let’s not go down that path, even as speculation~~~
You’re right: assuming that Mohamud would have never succeeded in making contact with real terrorists is pure speculation and worse than worthless.
Then why don’t the Fed get the militants instead of trying to create some?
Actually they have attempted “stings” and had “agent provocateurs” going after some of the organizations on the left such as Earth First and Greenpeace. (Think along the lines of the groups that PA’s ‘homeland security” was surveiling earlier this year)
But seemingly rarely for the groups on the right
A) The real thing would most likely be outside the country and the jurisdiction of the FBI.
B) That would have risked the operation being successfully carried out.
Here’s the short version, folks: the guy was trying to find someone to train and equip him to carry out an attack (he was the one who said he wanted to do an explosion: that didn’t come from the FBI). “Stinging” him seems like the right response to me; what do you think the FBI should have done?
“No, that he emailed a person asking how he could travel to Pakistan and join the fight for jihad”
That is quite vague. Saying “jihad” is not criminal and even waging “jihad” doesn’t necessarily mean against US targets. If one wanted to fight US targets, you’d think they’d ask about traveling to Afghanistan instead. Before someone gets put on the no-fly list, it should have to go before the court, like what happens with Temporary Restraining Orders (which the NFL is a type of restraining order that isn’t just temporary, which is all the more reason for judicial review).
“A) The real thing would most likely be outside the country and the jurisdiction of the FBI.”
You’re seriously claiming that it is outside the FBI’s jurisdiction to learn the identity of terrorists? As you admit, you don’t even know whether or not they’re in the US and within the direct jurisdiction of the FBI. For all you know you are discouraging the FBI from chasing down real terrorists in the US. Let’s say the FBI has been able to positively identify the “real thing,” wouldn’t the FBI pass it on to other branches of government within the US and/or seek extradition if said “real thing” is located outside the US. “Real thing” terrorists being located outside the US is hardly an excuse for being too lazy and headline happy to put in the work to identify real terrorists…”real thing” terrorists being outside the US is no excuse whatsoever to let them run free.
“B) That would have risked the operation being successfully carried out.”
Keeping oneself blissfully ignorant of the “real thing” risks terrorist operations being carried out. As you’ve pointed out, you don’t even known whether or not the “real thing” is here in the US right in your own backyard.
And Portland’s airport one of the few remaining American airports without the porno-scanners in place! Also, the first city to withdraw from the FBI’s Joint Terrorism Task Force, five years ago, due to civil liberties concerns.
No better example than Portland, I guess.
Okay.
Yes, excellent.
Great movie, all too realistic, I think.
That’s weird.
What are they up to?
Well, I recall a story a few months ago about a family that was unable to travel because their six-year-old son was on the no-fly list. They spent months trying to get him removed without success.
Yep. “Internal passports.” “Comrade, you do not have permission to reside in Moscow. Explain what you are doing here, please.”
“Before someone gets put on the no-fly list, it should have to go before the court, like what happens with Temporary Restraining Orders”
I agree, but whether the rules need to be changed is a separate issue from whether the existing rules were followed.
@ironymeter November 28th, 2010 at 5:57 pm I agree, but whether the rules need to be changed is a separate issue from whether the existing rules were followed.
Please explain the “existing rules” and where they might be found.
spanishinquisition: I’m not a LEO, are you? I would guess that the question do we bust the guy we have or try for bigger fish down the road? comes up often and the risk/benefit is calculated on a case-by-case basis.
In this case they decided to go for the bird in the hand instead of trying for the two in the bush. Was that decision influenced by politics, by publicity concerns? I don’t know, and neither do you.
You’ve pointed out some of the advantages of going for the two in the bush. I’ve pointed out some of the advantages of going for the bird in hand, which is a far cry from not wanting the FBI to catch the “real thing.”.
You’re just being a Monday morning quarterback, and doing it without all the facts, to boot.
Silly me: I thought preventing crimes was usually considered better than solving them after people had been killed.
Hadn’t heard that: what evidence against Mohamud was manufactured?
OT– I’ve seen no discussion of this device in public media or here. There is a clear photo of another scanning device to be used at transit check points and there is a photo of it on the TSA website showing the product labelling of “L-3 ProVision” (scroll down to the middle of the web page to see the device):
“In March 2010, TSA began deploying 450 advanced imaging technology units, which were purchased with American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (ARRA) funds.”
- excerpt from “Advanced Imaging Technology: An Overview,” accessed Nov. 28, 2010 (link: http://www.tsa.gov/approach/tech/ait/index.shtm )
I posted more detailed, publicly-available procurement information regarding the L-3 ProVision at the comment marked “mzchief November 15th, 2010 at 8:40 pm” (link: http://my.firedoglake.com/rayne/2010/11/15/angry-mom-and-the-daughter-groping-government/#comment-265520 ).
Hope that helps.
A “hapless dupe” is a guy who drives you to the liquor store thinking you’re going to buy a pack of smokes, not rob the place: the phrase doesn’t really fit someone knowingly attempting mass murder.
If you really think Mohamed was a hapless dupe then it seems reasonable to assume you’d like to see the case against him thrown out and he walks away?
First you ask me what should have been done and then you accuse me of being a Monday morning quarterback for answering your question. BTW since you are commenting after the fact, your own insult applies equally well to you. So Mr Monday Morning Quaterback, you can have the advantage of the FBI not putting in the leg-work of going after the “real thing,” which I guess the advantage to that is being able to remain in blissful ignorance of the real threats until they strike.
“since you are commenting after the fact, your own insult applies equally well to you.”
Uh… no: because I’m supporting the call the quarterback made, not sitting far away and half-informed deciding what he should have done differently.
I didn’t mean it as an insult, though: I just meant you’re not really in a position to make the call, not having been there, not having been trained, not having all the facts.