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I mentioned this the other day on a FDL thread and no one responded so I don’t know what to think. Besides being so disgusted with what is going on that I’m wondering if it’s even worth writing anything anymore (Obama seeking legislation to prohibit photos of abuse/torture, NO prosecutions of the bankers/companies that have brought about the coup d’etat of government,the ongoing lies and obfuscations by the CMM, the Obama Admin using Sen. Sessions-of all people- to undermine civil liberties,and the list can go on and on; some ‘change’ huh?), I’m very puzzled why the ‘progressive community’ isn’t screaming to high heaven about the delaying of whatever passes as a public option until 2013.
Here is the rational for such but I don’t buy it.
Letsgetitdone mentioned that only took 11 months for Medicare to begin paying benefits as have I. So why the delay? ESPECIALLY given the amounts of bailouts for the banks/financial communities and what has been done for them, including the lack of prosecutions(there were over 100 prosecutions for the Savings and Loan scandals of the 80′s which also ended up costing taxpayers(citizens) tons of money).
I had an estimator for a home improvement project tell me how his mother -who had her own business but couldn’t get health insurance reasonably($900 a month I don’t consider ‘reasonable’) died this past year from cancer because she had arthritic knees(‘pre-condition). So she was using a ‘free clinic’ that didn’t provide the early warning diagnosis that could have led to treatment before the disease had progressed to a point where no remission -even temporary- could be achieved.
So what are all the people who don’t have health insurance supposed to do until 2013? And why are not the voices of the ‘progressive community’ not screaming that such a delay is NOT ACCEPTABLE?
At this point, I wish I could have the opportunity to shake Obama’s hand so I could hand him my shoe.
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The Left is composed of two camps.
Camp 1: Everyone on the Left should give unqualified support to Obama.
Camp 2: Obama is a huge fucking disappointment.
Your message is not going to register with Camp 1.
It will register with Camp 2, but because members of Camp 2 are filled with frustration and anger, you need to spice it up to get their attention.
Try using lots of expletives to emphasize your points. You might also try using a poll that allows commenters to vent anger and frustration.
“Besides being so disgusted with what is going on that I’m wondering if it’s even worth writing anything anymore”; and it’s not a matter of ‘left’ or ‘rightwing’ but issues for our nation as a whole. My perspective is just mine but when I viewed this past Friday’s Moyer’s with Johnson and Kaptur, I understood in the depth of my soul just how our supposed representation is a complete illusion.
“BILL MOYERS: A reality check. Not one CEO of a Wall Street bank was there to hear the President. What do you make of that?
SIMON JOHNSON: Arrogance. Because they have no fear for the government anymore. They have no respect for the President, which I find absolutely extraordinary and shocking. All right? And I think they have no not an ounce of gratitude to the American people, who saved them, their jobs, and the way they run the world.”
And Moyers went on to point out that the ‘revolving door’ is well turned when it comes to the health of citizens.
I’m still waiting for someone to answer “And why are not the voices of the ‘progressive community’ not screaming that such a delay is NOT ACCEPTABLE?”
And tell me just what are the GOP ideas on healthcare? Americans must pay more money for drugs than everyone else in the world because drug company CEO’s need the money?
Americans must pay more for insurance than anyone else in the world does but unlike other countries we don’t insure everybody but we still pay more?
The Left unlike the GOP don’t like being taken.
ART We are passionate about making the world a better place and yes that passion turns to anger at those who stand in our way.
We are the Party of ideas ART the desire to help others is our Muse.
Your party says No to our ideas but has no ideas of its own. Well to be fair your side has ideas for financial ponzai schemes and bank bailouts, you support free trade to outsource American jobs, you supported the new Bankruptcy bill just in time to make filing for bankruptcy harder during a recession. Your economic policy is lets start a new bubble.
Rather than appeal to Moderate voters after losing the election you amp up the hate immigrants crowd.
You whine that Fuck Yes we swear but do we show up with guns to Town Hall meetings do Lefties run around shooting GOPers that KOZ or Jane said were our enemies? Nope!
So despite your sides attempt to stop the Town Hall meetings with guns early on if anything instead of scaring people away from Town Hall meetings you made people like me get off their asses and go to the meetings.
Asking questions that you should know the answers to is questionable. Ask yourself did you ever here even a long debate on spending money for the wars. Look it only took them a couple days to spend 700 billion on the banks. Almost 900 billion in one year for the recovery Act that hasn’t worked. Healthcare is not important so they can take all the time they want to debate it. They cry like a hundred billion a year is to much to spend on Healthcare. 800 billion on Iraq was just fine. All of that was our money, but whaen it is to be spent on us it becomes a big deal.
Gee the Myan’s said the world would end in 2012, so maybe that’s what they are thinking of. Put it off and they might not have to pay.
Actually, the Mayans indicated via their calendar that a ‘world age’ will end and another begin, not the end of the world. But I plan on being in EC come 12/2012 just in case the magnetic poles rapidly reverse and possibly see the crossing of the elliptical plane by the solar system.
And it’s the ‘progressive community’ I’m questioning, not the whores and pimps that pass for our government.
We wouldn’t be lucky enough for just a new age change. But no matter if the world doesn’t end we all will be no better off. By then we’ll all be so much in debt by our Government we may be wishing it would end.
The Mayans didn’t say that.
*******
“Definitely not, the Mayan Indian elder insists. “I came back from England last year and, man, they had me fed up with this stuff.”
It can only get worse for him. Next month Hollywood’s “2012″ opens in cinemas, featuring earthquakes, meteor showers and a tsunami dumping an aircraft carrier on the White House.
At Cornell University, Ann Martin, who runs the “Curious? Ask an Astronomer” Web site, says people are scared.
“It’s too bad that we’re getting e-mails from fourth-graders who are saying that they’re too young to die,” Martin said. “We had a mother of two young children who was afraid she wouldn’t live to see them grow up.”
Chile Pixtun, a Guatemalan, says the doomsday theories spring from Western, not Mayan ideas. ”
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/L/LT_MEXICO_APOCALYPSE_2012?SITE=DCSAS&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
“To the caring Women and Men of the World:
Below you will find a greeting and explanation from the Grand Maya Itza Council regarding 2012. I agreed with Council members to do everything I can to get this word out to the World.
It is simply this:
1) Their calendars do not END in 2012 – soon after 2012 we, on planet earth, will experience the return to the astronomical configurations present when one of the calendars was begun 26,000 years ago ……and we simply experience that day and move on into a new cycle…..of another 26,000 years……”
http://www.unobserver.com/index.php?folder=item1&pagina=enviroment.html
Does that mean they have 26,000 years before they have to make healthcare kick in?
And just in case the camp 1 actually exists, here is something for them to chew on:
Scary climate message from past ,remembering Obama has declared, like Bush, that the Kyoto Protocol is a dead issue and basically screwing up the climate negotiations now going on.
I guess I’m in Camp 2
Ya know, it’s funny, back in the old days – 2001 through early 2009 – we used to laugh at those who gave unqualified support to the President
Hi ubetchaiam, I’ve been screaming about this for months. I see few other people screaming, not even many of the Firedogs who take their cue from Jane. They’ll say that they want it earlier, alright. But they don’t say that 2013 is an outrage that is unacceptable, and that warrants defeating the bill.
The real rationales for 2013 are two: The first is to give the insurance companies more time to raise premiums and make money before any controls at all kick in. The second is to give the bills a better chance to be deficit neutral, because if Government expenditures were to start in 2010, the ten year projections would get a bad score from CBO. I think the “practical people” around here think that we can’t do anything about the deficit neutral over 10 years dogma in Congress, so we just have to suck it up and not complain too much about 2013.
Then the same folks who are making nary a peep about 2013, get really morally outraged over the opt-out compromise. I guess it makes them feel better, about calmly retreating from 1) single-payer, 2) a Hacker-type PO, and 3) a PO on an actual day one.
i’m still screaming whenever i’m around here (and whenever i’m not). thank you for your loud voice.
“Ya know, it’s funny, back in the old days – 2001 through early 2009 – we used to laugh at those who gave unqualified support to the President”
Pot, meet Mr. Kettle. Kettle, this is Mr. Pot. You two have a great deal in common.
Look Keep writing Diaries keep bring up the topic in comments I think everyone is focused on just getting public option for all 50 states now.
Details like Health Care now for everybody with drug prices Mexico and Canada pay they are all good ideas but as I said we are to focused on getting a bill passed.
Thankfully the Lake has some big picture people asking about details.
I fear Rahm will try and get a bad bill passed in the middle of the night.
If the GOP says we can’t afford a bill now we say then we can’t afford 2 wars people are losing jobs and their homes.
But Ossama is still out there yes but in Pakistan how do troops in Iraq and Afghanistan get him?
But But we send remote control planes with rockets after him!
Yes Bush did that for years Obama is doing it now Ossama is still alive Old age will get him before flying tinker toys will.
Time to stop spending money on lost causes and fix America.
Maybe we should kill healthcare now since Obama never spelled out what he wanted we should spell out what we want in addition to the public option. Why because No money for Healthcare then no money for 2 wars is a great rallying cry. Money only gets voted to bring the troops home.
No war then we can afford healthcare Now!
I am very scared. This supposed health reform has only worsened our situation so far. Yesterday I received an electronic phone call, asking me to punch 1 in order to join the fight to retain big subsidies for Medicare Advantage Plans, as otherwise seniors would be deprived of their benefits. Today my daughter tells me that the price for her health insurance plan for her family, which they use rarely, has doubled. Needless to say we all know this is because the health insurance industry is getting ready to bury us all, in order to squeeze the last drop of profit out of every one of us. I see our country collapsing if the excesses of the corporations are not reined in, and you know that is not going to happen. They are getting stronger, more brazen, and totally fearless by the minute. They know that they have bought all of our politicians, and that nobody cares about the citizens any more. We can blog, we can pray, we can make calls, we can donate, but it all doesn’t matter, because nobody pays any attention to us. I don’t know what the answer is. All I know is they will not stop until they kill the goose that lays the golden eggs, and yes, that is us. I say we charter buses, and millions of us deposit our shoes in front of the White House – and Wall Street, and the insurance companies, and Congress, and, and
Gabriele, you voice the same fear as Simon Johnson(who knows a thing ot two about finance):
“BILL MOYERS: So Simon, go ahead- you were saying- what is it that scares you? You’re worried?
SIMON JOHNSON: Another Great Depression. Right? If you don’t fix the financial system, Bill. If you allow them to have the same attitude. If you- if you actually allow them to increase their economic power, their ability to take risk, and their belief that they can shove the losses onto the government. And that’s why they didn’t show up to President Obama’s speech on Wall Street.
BILL MOYERS: Why don’t they respect him?
SIMON JOHNSON: Because they think that the next time they won’t even have to ask. They’ll just be given the bailout that they want.
MARCY KAPTUR: Right. That’s been their history. Their bed is feathered. When they messed up during the 1980s, they put their bill through the savings and loans crisis on the American people. $140 billion.
BILL MOYERS: And we’re still paying that off, by the way. I think the last payment will be made in 2013.
MARCY KAPTUR: Very good. Most people don’t even know that.”
Hello people !!!!! SEE THAT DATE FOR PAYING OFF THE DEBTS TAXPAYERS ASSUMED FOR THE S+L BAILOUT?
because obamaco wants to keep health insurance company political donations coming to the dems instead of going to the republicans. and 2013 keeps the gravy train on board for obama’s re-election plans in 2012.
jane has connected the dots
….
that doesn’t mean i’m not outraged though. if anything, understanding that it’s all based on re-election calculations outrages me even more.
but for me even worse is not just leaving the insurance companies in place, but making them stronger via the mandate.
and worst of all is leaving at least 17 million with no insurance and millions more underinsured as cost continue to escalate with no controls in sight.
We all know what answer is, and that is make the Congress listen to us. They won’t because we don’t have what it would take to do that. So we are at their mercy, waiting to see what they will give us.
I’ll tell you the pig story to give you a hint what’s needed. My wife when she was a kid went to the pig pen and a big pig attacked her. Her dad came home and went out to fix the fence on the pen the pig attacked Him. He had a hammer in His hand, so he smacked the pig right between the eyes. From that day on the pig was more like a puppy dog.
You see you have to get their attention before they will listen, a hammer can be a good thing.
Money, which provides for an almost assured election or re-election, overwhelms the hammer; paper over rock, remember?
It’s why I have no hope unless and until public financing of ALL campaigns is mandatory AND the fallacy that corporations have the same legal rights as a living breathing person is removed.
I understand from a human perspective the ‘hope’ others have but I find such to be a denial of the existential reality of the status now evident.