Behind closed doors, Senators Carl Levin and John McCain have added a couple new sections to the NDAA that could find Americans arrested, locked up indefinitely without charge, and being shunted into the military tribunal system. There would be no guarantees, of course, that detainees would ever see the inside of even a military courtroom.
The ACLU is not just fooling around with their title: ‘Senators Demand the Military Lock Up citizens in the ‘Battlefield’ They Define as Being Outside Your Window’.
“The Senate is going to vote on whether Congress will give this president—and every future president — the power to order the military to pick up and imprison without charge or trial civilians anywhere in the world. Even Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas) raised his concerns about the NDAA detention provisions during last night’s Republican debate. The power is so broad that even U.S. citizens could be swept up by the military and the military could be used far from any battlefield, even within the United States itself.
The worldwide indefinite detention without charge or trial provision is in S. 1867, the National Defense Authorization Act bill, which will be on the Senate floor on Monday.”
(Yes, the ‘even Ron Paul’ mention is gratuitous, IMO. But that’s a whole ‘nother subject, and not for today.)
Let’s look at the objections the White House apparently has:
“Any bill that challenges or constrains the President’s critical authorities to collect intelligence, incapacitate dangerous terrorists, and protect the Nation would prompt the President’s senior advisers to recommend a veto,” the White House said in a statement.
The Administration strongly objects to the military custody provision,” the White House said, noting that it could apply to people in the United States. That “would raise serious and unsettled legal questions and would be inconsistent with the fundamental American principle that our military does not patrol our streets.”
If enacted, sections 1031 and 1032 of the NDAA would:
1) Explicitly authorize the federal government to indefinitely imprison without charge or trial American citizens and others picked up inside and outside the United States;
(2) Mandate military detention of some civilians who would otherwise be outside of military control, including civilians picked up within the United States itself; and
(3) Transfer to the Department of Defense core prosecutorial, investigative, law enforcement, penal, and custodial authority and responsibility now held by the Department of Justice.
The ACLU continues (sorry for the cut-paste nature of this diary; I’m jammed in RL):
“In support of this harmful bill, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) explained that the bill will “basically say in law for the first time that the homeland is part of the battlefield” and people can be imprisoned without charge or trial “American citizen or not.” Another supporter, Sen. Kelly Ayotte (R-N.H.) also declared that the bill is needed because “America is part of the battlefield.” (my bold)
The solution is the Udall Amendment; a way for the Senate to say no to indefinite detention without charge or trial anywhere in the world where any president decides to use the military. Instead of simply going along with a bill that was drafted in secret and is being jammed through the Senate, the Udall Amendment deletes the provisions and sets up an orderly review of detention power. It tries to take the politics out and put American values back in.”
So; anyone want to say ‘domestic terrorists’? Will protesters continue to be labeled ‘terrorists’ as per a 2003 FBI memo that pretty much conflated protesting with ‘terror’:
“A confidential FBI memorandum sent to over 15,000 local law enforcement agencies in October urged them to “be alert to these possible indicators of protest activity and report any potentially illegal acts to the nearest FBI Joint Terrorism Task Force.” Among the “criminal activities” of protesters catalogued in the memo are “use of the internet to recruit, raise funds, and coordinate their activities prior to demonstrations” as well as “[d]uring the course of a demonstration … using cell phones or radios to coordinate activities or to update colleagues about ongoing events.”
Other examples of criminal activity cited include using tape recorders and video cameras, which “may be used for documenting potential cases of police brutality and for distribution of information over the internet”; wearing scarves and sunglasses “to minimize the effects of tear gas and pepper spray as well as obscure one’s identity”; and wearing “layered clothing” as a form of “body protection equipment.”
The implications of the memo are sweeping. There is hardly anyone among protest demonstrators who has not worn sunglasses, layered clothing or used a cell phone. By making an amalgam of these commonplace activities with “more aggressive tactics,” including terrorism, the FBI has made millions of people the potential subjects of police surveillance.” (my bold)
Mitch Green writing at new economic perspectives has penned a ‘Letter to the Winter Patriot’, anticipating the day the military will be called in to break up Occupies around the nation.
He reminds them of their oaths to protect and serve, and the inherent conflict in these times:
“Those that take this oath seriously are faced with a terrible conflict. You must battle internally between the affirmation that you will place your body between the social contract embedded in the Constitution and those that seek its destruction, while maintaining your loyalty to the government you serve and the orders issued by its officers. Sadly, society has placed a twin tax upon you by asking that you sacrifice both your body and your morality. This tax has been levied solely upon you overseas, and soon they’ll come to collect domestically. Your government in its expression of corporate interests relies upon your tenacity to endure, and your relentless willingness to sacrifice. And so you do.
Now, more than ever we need your sacrifice. But, I’m asking you to soldier in a different way. If called upon to deny the people of their first amendment right to peaceably assemble and petition their government for a redress of grievance, disregard the order. Abstain from service. Or if you are so bold, join us. Make no mistake: The consequences for such decisions are severe. You will be prosecuted under the full extent of the law. But sacrifice is your watch word.”
If the NDAA passes with sections 1031 and 1032 intact, will Obama veto it, and why or why not? Before you vote, remember (deleted: you know what you need to know before you vote…).
From Obey (with thanks) at kgbloz.com in answer to my posting the ACLU piece there:
“Matt Taibbi sums it all up nicely:
‘… when we abandoned our principles in order to use force against terrorists and drug dealers, the answer to the question, What are we defending? started to change.
The original answer, ostensibly, was, “We are defending the peaceful and law-abiding citizens of the United States, their principles, and everything America stands for.”
Then after a while it became, “We’re defending the current population of the country, but we can’t defend the principles so much anymore, because they weigh us down in the fight against a ruthless enemy who must be stopped at all costs.”
Then finally it became this: “We are defending ourselves, against the citizens who insist on keeping their rights and their principles.”’
Matt’s final sentences about the pepper-sprayed US Davis students said it perfectly:
“Bravo to those kids who hung in there and took it. And bravo for standing up and showing everyone what real strength is. There is no strength without principle. You have it. They lost it. It’s as simple as that.”
Stay strong and loving, and know that we will prevail. We must!
(cross-posted at www.kgblogz.com)



64 Comments

Wendy, I am so glad you posted this. I was rooting around, trying to read through the Senate bill, and getting bug-eyed.
Please, all you readers, note that Wendy’s link “Udall Ammendment, takes you to the ACLU website and a petition to your state reps to include it.
Or, click here: https://secure.aclu.org/site/Advocacy?cmd=display&page=UserAction&id=3865&s_subsrc=fixNDAA
Highly recommended!
Thanks, Eclair, for posting the link for contacting Senators. I think I was feeling futile about our messages being heard any longer, so I kinda hoped folks would click through and find it if they were looking for it. ;o)
Haven’t even bothered checking into Michael Bennet’s ‘stand’ on it (likely saying he ‘hasn’t studied it enough to know yet); such an asshat, he goes with whichever way he calculates the political winds are blowing.
Did you discover any more about the Fort Collins Occupy? I emailed them five or six days ago, never heard back….they used to be a strong group, as I remember.
Thanks so much for this most important read.
Rcc’d.
I first heard about this at the Occupy Houston GA on Friday night.
This should emphasize the fact that the actions against the Occupy Movement are in response to the message and are not about sanitation, petty crime or reopening the spaces to the general public.
Ah, well, Bennet …..
I’m not feeling optimistic about our on-line petitions, either. But, if it only takes a few minutes to fill out, well, I do it. Kind of like not walking under a ladder; what the heck, doesn’t hurt and it could help.
Have not been back to Fort Collins and a return trip there and to Greeley (and, perhaps) Boulder, will have to wait until week of December 4th. I will be in Austin next week and hope to visit Occupy Austin while I am there.
They think they can make what they are doing “legal”. They don’t want to be bothered by opposition from the courts. The courts are the very LEAST of their problems. Three hundred million Americans are their real problem.
In 2002, the Justice Department drafted a follow-up to the original Patriot Act with even more draconian provisions. Its contents were leaked to the press, and both the administration and Congress quickly backed away…for the time being.
Since then, the provisions of Patriot Act II have been passed on a piecemeal basis. However, even Patriot Act II didn’t provide for the indefinite detention of American citizens on suspicion of terrorism. The farthest it went was stripping people of their American citizenship if they joined a terrorist group.
Oh Really !?
http://www.alternet.org/occupywallst/153170/%22how_could_this_happen_in_america%22_why_police_are_treating_americans_like_military_threats/?page=entire
Recommended. Tweeted. Thanks Wendy. ACLU petition, signed.
:o) plus: good on you, Eclair.
Security State is indeed in the air.
Every step they crack down on us will empower us, though there will be dark times ahead.
Coupled with all the moves toward Total Information Awareness systems and the SOPA act…you can almost feel their fear and loathing. Especially fear. They should be afraid, IMO.
We’ll see about this one; it should pass from what I’ve read. Will Obama actually veto it? Can’t imagine it.
Well, there’s objecting, and then there’s objecting, cmaukonen.
Welcome, BooRadley.
This needs front page coverage! Thank you Wendy , I was just about to write a post about this before I saw you had beat me to it !
This is the real reson for political activism , to stave of fascism !
Recommended !
I concur with your remarks – Wendy’s post is one of the more important ones today.
Thanks Wendy for this most informative post!
Highly recommended!!
Welcome, freeman. As always with news of this sort, I kept checking on the front page and my.fdl to see if had been covered while I clicked it together. Even went to Emptywheel’s place; nope.
Welcome, billyc.
Obama won’t veto it. He believes that “9/11 changed everything,” and that we can no longer afford civil liberties as we remember them. I will not vote for him next year.
Nice reference, cmaukonen. I am constantly in awe of those founding fathers (probably spurred on by their wives, the founding mothers), who spent time reading and discussing political philosophy – instead of working for Wall Street investment banks and watching Reality TV.
So at what point does “protest and dissent” segue into “civil war?”
I think you’re right. Neo-fascists to the left of us, neo-fascists to the right…
Marcy had a piece on this a couple of days ago. According to her, the administration’s REAL objection was to any limitations on the use of the indefinite detention provision against American citizens.
I clipped this one shekissesfrogs stuck into one of my diaries awhile ago; you have to let it wriggle its way into your consciousness for a few ticks, to see how applicable it is:
““A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”
~Marcus Tullius Cicero (106-43 B.C.)
Roman Statesman, Speech in the Roman Senate 58
Well, shoot, Beach; I even went looking for it and missed it. Rats; thanks for the correction. ‘…objection to any limitations on the use…’ Arggh. I’ll take her word on it, but I’ll go now and fetch the piece.
I almost mentioned Obama could do something jiggy with signing statements on this one, but I couldn’t think through what one might look like to achieve his ends. Hmmm. Looks like he ‘contributed’ one to last year’s NDAA.
http://www.emptywheel.net/2011/11/21/its-the-zenith-limiting-war-declaration-not-the-detainee-restrictions-obama-wants-to-veto/
Should have gone further back into her archives, it looks like.
“Gerstein’s right that Obama stopped short of vetoing the Defense Authorization last year, which had those limits, instead issuing a signing statement.
“Despite my strong objection to these provisions, which my Administration has consistently opposed, I have signed this Act because of the importance of authorizing appropriations for, among other things, our military activities in 2011.”
Nevertheless, my Administration will work with the Congress to seek repeal of these restrictions, will seek to mitigate their effects, and will oppose any attempt to extend or expand them in the future.
And Obama didn’t issue a veto threat on similar restrictions place on DHS funding.”
But Obama has issued a veto threat on “detainee and related issues” before–on Buck McKeon’s version of the Defense Authorization in May. That version added a couple of things to last year’s Defense Authorization: More limits on when the government can use civilian courts to try terrorists, limits on the detainee review system beyond what Obama laid out in an Executive Order last year.
Oh Please Please Please more money for more war. What does a chicken hawk President and an incompetent General Betrayus have to do? How about attacking some country’s military outposts? Yes!
Obama and Betrayus attacked Pakistan Army outposts, killing 28 soldiers! Well done fellows! Except this attack may not have killed any women and children, which is unusual.
What a great war! What great war leaders, especially Lindsay Graham. The Battlefield is EVERYWHERE! Lindsay will kill you anywhere because he is Godlike.
This is a frequent occurrence, “collateral murder”. Usually, the US War Leaders pay the corrupt Pakistan officials a few billion dollars, from US taxpayers. Then everyone will be happy again, especially Gay Lindsay Graham.
0 will do what he and doj does best F*&^ Main Street because it’s an election yr and that’s what the masters of Amerika want.
Sorry I needed to say Thanks for bring this up. The vote might be held the first of the week call/email what ever to spot this in it’s tracks
Blood money reparations. At least ISAF will investigate itself. Kinda like Israel investigating itself over…oh; never mind. Don’t feel like sticking my head in the fucking oven.
And everyone claims not to know WHY that attack was orchestrated. Good gawd almighty.
But please; let’s leave off about Lindsey’s being gay. It may be the best part of him, though he does keep it in the dark if it’s so.
I meant “gay” as being happy. Because Linsay is happy when the Battlefield Is Everywhere. And the Wars are endless. Lindsay is among America’s greatest and happiest war leaders.
Ooopsie! Thought you were kinda calling him ‘Aunt Pittypat’ like John Aravosis, et.al… they justify it on accountta his hypocrisy.
I apologize; I use the term ‘gay’ in the old way often, too. ‘Queer’, also. And ‘sluttish’ means crap house-keeping…old school, Olde Crone is I. ;o)
“He rots the soul of a nation.” Amazing that words written over 2,000 years ago can still send shivers up your spine.
And Marcus Tullius knew what he was talking about, living through the period when Rome was becoming Imperial.
The Washington Post’s reporting about the Administration’s position on Sections 1031 and 1032 is most curious. The Post wrote:
But here is what the Administration actually said in the official “Statement of Administration Policy”:
Note that while the Administration did, elsewhere, raise concerns that there might be legal problems extending the military custody provision to American citizens, the specific quote referenced by the Washington Post omitted the essence of the Administration’s argument which was the “mandatory” nature of the proposed law. More on that later.
First, let’s address the Administration’s comments on Section 1031.
“The Administration objects to and has serious legal and policy concerns about many of the detainee provisions in the bill.”
Sounds pretty good so far… until you hear why they object.
The White House is expressing concern that they already have all the authorization they need under the Authorization for the Use of Military Force Act (AUMF) of 2001. This act has been used by the NSA and the Justice Department to use electronic surveillance on Americans without any oversight by the Courts.
The Administration’s fear is not that Section 1031 will authorize spying on Americans and authorize denying them their habeas corpus rights but that civil libertarians might well challenge detention powers the White House believes it already has. Obama isn’t worried about the further erosion of Constitutional liberties; he’s worried existing Presidential authorizations to circumvent the Constitution will be jeopardized.
The picture gets no brighter on Section 1032.
Once again, it sounds like Obama et al is off to a good start with:
“The Administration strongly objects to the military custody provision of section 1032, which would appear to mandate military custody for a certain class of terrorism suspects.”
Sounds like the Administration objects to all this military custody business, doesn’t it?
Well, no, actually it doesn’t.
They aren’t objecting to “military custody”; they are objecting to “mandatory” military custody.
Here’s what they said:
Tragically, the key argument being made here is not an argument on behalf of Constitutional liberties although concerns about using the military “to patrol our streets” was referred to as a fundamental American principle; the argument being made is one of law enforcement efficiencies. The administration is arguing that national security professionals should have flexibility on a case-by-case basis rather than have a “mandatory” military custody requirement imposed on them by statute.
Obama won’t veto the NDAA if it reaches his desk in its current form. He might, perhaps, prefer not to subject his administration to Constitutional challenges and might prefer not to alienate his political base by signing into law a further erosion of civil liberties, but there’s no way in hell he will let the Republicans play the “weak on defense” card that could put his re-election at risk. These are pretty shallow reasons to use the Constitution as toilet paper.
Sorry, jo6pac; as I said to Eclair, I have zero faith any longer that contacting my Senators means…anything. But please: as she said, it’s painless to sign the ACLU petition, and she had fun with the ‘walking under an open ladder’ metaphor. ;o)
“Mark Udall (D-CO) has proposed an amendment to strip the provisions out of the Defense Authorization bill. It is Amendment 1107. Americans who oppose these provisions should immediately contact the Senate switchboard and tell your Senators to vote yes on Amendment 1107 of S. 1867
United States Capitol switchboard at (202) 224-3121. This number will connect you to any Senators switchboard.”
https://www.examiner.com/political-buzz-in-charleston-sc/lindsey-graham-calls-for-using-military-against-american-citizens
Even some of the far right is stirred up about this.
Thanks, welshT, for the WH’s comparative slides along some legal continuum…pretty tragic, is right.
At this point I’m beginning to wonder if he CAN win re-election, not that I care a whit.
‘…toilet paper’. ;o(
Sleep well, I guess; gonna be more of this.
At least the Libertarian…right? It gets confusing, doesn’t it? As ACLU said: ‘…even Ron Paul mentioned it…’ LOL! ‘Even’; sure it would bother him, thank goodness.
And thanks for the number; I just can’t make the calls. I’m worn out by now not being heard. (Of course, Udall is one of my Senators…)
Sleep tight and stay strong.
Thank you for pointing out Wendy’s link; takes only seconds to sign the petition.
Wonderful quote, Wendy, and great diary, too. Many thanks for bringing this to our attention. I’m hoping that the sunshine of public awareness will scare the rats in Congress back into their holes for a while.
I agree–this needs and deserves front page coverage! I have been reading this website for months now, and am still mystified by the way stories that I think are extremely important, and which are commented on by many people, often vanish in less than a day.
I heard a report about this air strike on the radio, and the news reader was saying that it is very difficult to know, in that area, if a given place is inside Pakistan, or outside Pakistan’s border.
Huh? How can my Garmin Nuvi tell me EXACTLY where I am, within a few feet, at all times, but the U.S. military has to GUESS what country its planes are attacking?
This “gay” discussion reminds me of a great cartoon I saw once: A sweet elderly couple are standing in their yard, talking across the fence to their neighbors, a couple of young men, and the old husband is saying, “My wife and I have a gay marriage, too!”
The real physical world is one thing, political borders are something else entirely. There are parts that are disputed between Pakistan and Afghanistan as to who they actually “belong” to – although in reality neither country can really exercise much authority beyond what’s under the boots of soldiers they put there.
FDL
Front page. Please!
“Let the die be cast” –Julius Caesar from Plutarch, ‘The life of Pompey’
“A house divided against itself cannot stand.” Abraham Lincoln, 1858
And it will be revolution and civil war.
And when the bloody deed is complete, we will hardly recognize the place from which we started. (Obverse of T. S. Elliot)
And on the battlefield, legal niceties such as the right to free speech, the right to assemble, the right to be secure in one’s person and papers, the right to an attorney, the right of habeas corpus, the right not to incriminate yourself, the right to due process, the right to a speedy and public trial with an impartial jury of one’s peers… all go away. How very convenient for fascists like Graham.
This showed up in my inbox just now. Who the F**K are these guys?
Dear Wm,
Last week we told you about an important opportunity in the Senate to turn the page on a decade of war in Iraq and Afghanistan. The Senate can vote as early as today on these important amendments!
Call the Capitol Switchboard toll-free at 1-877-429-0678 to be connected to your Senator and tell them:
“It’s time to turn the page on the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Please support Amendment 1174 by Sen. Merkley and Amendment 1064 by Sen. Paul to the National Defense Authorization Act.”
The Senate is currently considering the 2012 National Defense Authorization Act, and will vote on amendments as early as today. Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-OR) has offered an amendment to accelerate the drawdown of U.S. troops from Afghanistan. Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) has offered an amendment to repeal the 2002 authorization for the Iraq War.
Today is the best chance to ask your Senator to stand with the American people by finally putting a long decade of war behind us.
The Senate can vote at any time on these amendments so please call your Senator now at 1-877-429-0678 and ask them to vote yes on Amendments 1174 and 1064 to the National Defense Authorization Act.
Sincerely,
Tom, Stephen, and the Win Without War Team”
ROTFLMAO!
(Thanks, Coach; I sure did need the laugh this mornin’!) Whoohooo!
It is an X-file, Kris. ;o)
Shahid Battar got some of it right, left out some…but he says:
“Madison and Jefferson would each roll in their graves at Congress betrayal of their legacy.
The one positive aspect to Levin-McCain’s essentially Soviet proposal is the hope it offers to inspire unity among Americans. There may yet remain principles, even if merely as meager as the right to trial, on which we all can agree.
Torn between the Tea Party, Occupy Wall Street movement and alienated moderates, much of America shares a rejection of Washington’s habitual foolishness. And with these competing movements having already organized and mobilized so many diverse Americans, there has been no better time to come together.”
http://www.truth-out.org/military-detention-vs-we-people/1322380800
The bold takes you to the Bill of Rights Defense Committee (haven’t read it yet):
http://bordc.org/action/
‘Obverse’: LOL! Clipped the three defintions, stuck ‘em in a Help file for blogging; haven’t gotten the gist yet…so I don’t use ‘em lest I sound more ignorant than I actually am. ;o) (Did I say that right? Hmmm…)
Plus, it would be easier to not know where your ‘bug-splat targets’ were…if ya really didn’t *want to know* where they were.
This brings to mind the Einstein quote that “the difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.” :<)
I also like my homegrown twist on the famous Lincoln quote:
"You can fool some of the people some of the time but you can't fool some of the people some of the time."
Great thread, btw.
LOL! Luckily, my ig’rance is unlimited; always room to improve!
I also like: Newt Gingrich can be judged as smart by stupid people.’ ;o)
Nope; your Fractured Lincoln Quote gave me an epileptic seizure. (minor, but still bent mah brain…) ;oP
Stuff like this has confused and discombobulated people in this area. It’s been a long, serious “holiday” “weekend” and I am not laughing.
Humor is one of the only ways I continue to make it. Seriously, and luckily I am funny as hell.
I just came back to (yeppers) laugh at the way The Hill portrays the ‘problem’ with the MDAA:
“The White House opposes mandatory military custody for terror suspects, arguing it should be able to transfer some to the civilian court system. The administration also opposes an indefinite ban on transferring Guantánamo detainees.”
Of course, the Senators are kinda sorta saying it’s that simple (or that they are that simple…)
This part’s a doozey:
“No provision in the legislation expands the authority under which detainees can be held in military custody. On the contrary, it codifies detention authority that has been adopted by two administrations and upheld in the courts. The bill states clearly that it does not expand or limit the president’s authorities under the original 2001 authorization of the use of force against al-Qaeda. ”
(The threats at the end aren’t bad, though…)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/defense-bill-offers-balance-in-dealing-with-detainees/2011/11/27/gIQAf2Qn2N_story.html
And it was nice to see it was posted in the ‘Opinion’ section. ;o)
“The bill states clearly that it does not expand or limit the president’s authorities under the original 2001 authorization of the use of force against al-Qaeda. ”
Heard Glen Greenwald on Democracy Now this morning explaining how limiting the original authorization of force really was and how both Bush and Obama have pretty much ignored it.
Thanks, Coach. We get DN tonight; we’ll listen then. Pretty low bar they describe, too:
‘…codifies detention authority that has been adopted by two administrations and upheld in the courts.’ Bet Greenwald and Marcy would have some bones to pick with *that one*. And they could cite cases off the top of their heads.
Marcy Wheeler Provides Insight To This Complicated Issue.
Excerpt from Mz. Wheeler’s fine, fine detailed read:
What I want to know is why the ACLU is recommending yes on the Udall amendment? Why not no on the whole bill, surely there is nothing but hogwash in the whole bill.
hey, ask jane to give you my contact info for when you’re in austin.
In all the years I’ve been hanging around FDL, this is the most important urgent issue I’ve seen and the front page is not even addressing it and this diary is also off the recommended list. I even sent Jane an urgent email last night asking that this be addressed. Crickets.
God fucking damn. So many people could have taken action if FDL had chosen to give it attention.
If this passes, it just gets that much harder to occupy and protest at all.
To me, NONE of what’s been on the front page or the other diaries today is more important than this.
Forget the trees, this is the whole damn forest.